Ep. 242: It's Not X, It's Y

[00:00:04] Speaker A: All right, hit me, Mark. [00:00:05] Speaker B: Okay, go. [00:00:06] Speaker A: Oh, right. One, two, three. [00:00:09] Speaker B: Hope you weren't planning on just going in then. Without the clap. [00:00:12] Speaker A: So sorry. [00:00:12] Speaker B: Done that every single episode. Unconscionable episodes. I'm not having that. All right, look. Is there anything as stupid and as pointless and laughable and just as pathetic, almost risible, you know what I mean? Just hollow and worthless. Is there any more craven, a waste of time and effort and money and endeavor? Is there anything as hollow as man's pursuit to become a space faring species? Grow up, please. [00:01:02] Speaker A: I, I feel like I'm somewhat surprised to hear you say that. Just as like a space fan. But. No, I think you're. You're not wrong. Obviously we need to learn about space, but it is weird how dedicated we are to like trying to. Trying to be up there. [00:01:19] Speaker B: Ridiculous. 60, 70 years, right? With as I speak to you right now, the sum total of getting a little bit higher. [00:01:31] Speaker A: Yeah, that's true. [00:01:32] Speaker B: Isn't that stupid? [00:01:35] Speaker A: Yeah, I guess when you frame it that way it is. I mean, I guess I don't really know what like people do up on the iss. I assume it's important or whatever, but. [00:01:45] Speaker B: They do a lot of shite, mate. They float around and they wave to school kids, you know what I mean, Running on their little treadmill. [00:01:55] Speaker A: I remember that growing up in space. [00:01:59] Speaker B: Is it? [00:02:00] Speaker A: Well, I remember there were like the, the twin astronauts, right. Mark and the other one, their names are completely escaping right now. One of them is married to Gabby Giffords, but they, one of them went on the ISS for X amount of time and the other one, while he has been to space, has never like stayed for a long period of time. And I remember that because they're twins they were able to do like all kinds of interesting like studies about like what like, like cellular processes and like stuff like that between like how does stuff in your body work? Because they could see what happened to one in space and the other one. Yeah, it's neat. I mean, I don't know if it's necessary, but it's actually. They do interesting stuff up there. Yeah. [00:02:50] Speaker B: I mean just to qualify everything I've said in the last two minutes, that's also why it's so fucking cool and brilliant. Right, Right. [00:02:59] Speaker A: It's. It's kind of. It goes to the Everest thing, doesn't it? You know. Why do you, why do you climb Everest, Mark? [00:03:05] Speaker B: Well, yeah, because it's there, but it doesn't. It both. Doesn't, doesn't speak to that. I mean there is at least I can. If I were to reach and stretch, at least I could see some kind of tangible value to climbing Everest. I can see some kind of value to it. But, you know, so pointless is life down here. It. It feels only natural and right and beautiful for humanity. If, if, if. If you've learned nothing about me in the last five years, surely you. You know that it's the ridiculous. And the pointless is the. The is where the fucking beauty lies. It's the only thing that holds beauty, really, in the face of all the awful truth, in the face of the awful pointlessness of everything. Why not? Why the fuck not, right? It amounts to nothing because three or four miles up into the sky, the stars are no fucking nearer at all, right? It achieves fuck all and comes at the cost of such a lot of effort, man. And so many. So many disasters. [00:04:15] Speaker A: Oh, boy. [00:04:17] Speaker B: So many absolute. [00:04:19] Speaker A: Let me say, you know this. I feel good about this being where you're going with this, because if there's one thing I can say with full 100% certainty, it's that I will never be in space. Like, even if this planet is about to blow up and they're like, corrigan, get on the ship. We gotta go. I ain't going. I'm going down with this ship. So we're not activating any of my phobias today. I'm ready to just hear about why. [00:04:48] Speaker B: Good. [00:04:49] Speaker A: It's bad up there. [00:04:51] Speaker B: Well, good. I mean, just a. Just to give you a little bit of context as to why this is on my mind today, we've been to the National Space center in Leicester today, right? Oh, and it's like the third time I've been. And I love it. I'd like to go there every day, right? I like to go there every single morning for a few hours and just wander around and look at all the cool space. Because there's so much. There's. There's like, actual stuff that's been to space. There's a little. Little bit of moon rock and they sell. [00:05:21] Speaker A: I love that everywhere has some moon rock. [00:05:23] Speaker B: Like, oh, yeah. [00:05:24] Speaker A: It feels like it's a thing that should be, like, super rare. But, like, every museum's got a moon rock. [00:05:30] Speaker B: Yeah. I wonder if every moon rock that purports to be moonrock is in fact. Moonrock is the amount of moon rock. [00:05:37] Speaker A: I don't even. I don't know if they do this at that one, but, like, at the. The one of the museums, whatever, like, kind of space museum in Chicago, you can touch it even there's like a little hole in the plastic and you can rub the moon rock. [00:05:49] Speaker B: Oh, I love that. No, all the moon. [00:05:50] Speaker A: It doesn't feel like anything. [00:05:52] Speaker B: Do you know I went when I went to the States as a kid. I say kid, you know, teenager, Sure. I went. We went to a church, right? And this particular church had a piece of moon rock in one of the stained glass windows. [00:06:12] Speaker A: Well, that's interesting, isn't it? That feels like something out of, like, sci fi where, like, they have a moon. It's like a traditional church. But it turns out that, like, yeah, they were. [00:06:21] Speaker B: Love that. [00:06:21] Speaker A: The moon. [00:06:22] Speaker B: Oh, that's a great idea. Put that in the file. Put that in the joag file. [00:06:25] Speaker A: All right. [00:06:26] Speaker B: Well, yeah, yeah, they had a. They had a moon rock kind of fabricated into the stained glass window. It was lovely. [00:06:34] Speaker A: Fascinating. [00:06:34] Speaker B: But, yeah, the National Space center in Leicester. What a fantastic facility. It's. It looks all sci fi. It's like this huge effigy of glass and plastic. And they've got an actual rocket in there. And they've got like an actual genuine USSR Soyuz capsule in there. Like the actual one. Nice spacesuits. And it's just sick. But what they also have is a lot of detail on the tragedies, right? The tragedies memorialized astronauts and cosmonauts and canines and primates who have suffered and died. [00:07:21] Speaker A: Oh, no. [00:07:22] Speaker B: For this. [00:07:23] Speaker A: You're not gonna tell me about dead dogs, are you? [00:07:25] Speaker B: No, I'm not gonna talk about dead dogs. [00:07:27] Speaker A: I was like, I've changed my mind. I don't want to hear about this anymore. [00:07:30] Speaker B: But I am gonna talk about dead people. [00:07:32] Speaker A: Yeah, that's fine. We do that. [00:07:35] Speaker B: Because if you think. What is it called? Compression diving? Is that what it's called? [00:07:41] Speaker A: Saturation. [00:07:42] Speaker B: Saturation diving? I think that's tough. If you think mining is tough, if you think aviation generally is tough, then space flight is an entirely different animal. It's tough and it's dangerous. And even when you get to space, it is ruinous on the body. You know, you lose like a percentage of your bone density every fucking week you're up there, right? Your muscle. [00:08:07] Speaker A: That's one of the things that seems bananas to me that, like, people voluntarily go up there and it's like, bruh. [00:08:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:14] Speaker A: Like the shit that is doing to your body is insane. [00:08:18] Speaker B: Your blood doesn't distribute through your body properly because gravity is all fucked. So your heart is. It doesn't really know what up is. Down and down is up. You know what I mean? It's Fucked. [00:08:30] Speaker A: I get like out of whack if I change time zones, you know, if I go to the other side of the world, like my body doesn't know where or what I am for like years. So this is. [00:08:40] Speaker B: If I fucking stand up too quickly, if I just simply rise to my feet just a little bit too quickly, I feel like I'm gonna become acquainted with the ground really quickly, right. I fuck that. Fuck space flight. Fuck it. But it's beautiful. But I hate it. But I love it, right? Just like all of the things that keep me awake at night. This particular visit to the National Space Center. They've got a new. They're all about Mars for some reason right now. And they've got the big. [00:09:10] Speaker A: Does seem to be the thing. [00:09:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm all for it. I love Mars. And they've got the biggest planet planetariums that we call it the big dome. Yeah, the biggest one of those in the uk and this wonderful kind of film about what a Mars mission might look like. Oh, so good. Oh God, I love Mars. I love Mars. So good. So listen, let me in a classic early joag kind of format, yeah. I'm gonna rank the most lethal space faring and rocket propulsion accidents all the way up to an absolute banger. Right? So let's start. [00:09:50] Speaker A: Okay. [00:09:51] Speaker B: A lot of these, as you might expect, are going to be in the former Soviet Republic, right? Well, yeah, because man, they were super into it. So come if you will to 1967 firstly. And the sorry tale of the Soyuz won now on re entry, right. This was a mission that was all about a kind of a public demonstration of the new Soyuz craft. And it, it's its capability to dock with the first ever space station, the Soyuz 2. Right? [00:10:25] Speaker A: Sure. [00:10:26] Speaker B: But the thing about the Soyuz 1 was it was 1967 and it was fucked before they launched it. They knew that it was fucked. [00:10:35] Speaker A: Oh no, right, come on. [00:10:37] Speaker B: Tests were fucking catastrophic. It had a solar panel that didn't deploy. The guidance systems were fucked. The team, the engineers had logged an incredible 200 or more problems with this craft pre flight. [00:10:58] Speaker A: That's so wild because like when you think back on space travel in those early days in the 1960s, like it's wild that they even managed to make it work. All considering where computers were and stuff like that. Like, like Elon still blowing up a rocket a day in 2025. [00:11:18] Speaker B: Incredible, incredible. But they fucking launched it anyway, right? Political pressure, you know, the world stage. [00:11:28] Speaker A: Yeah, they were trying to show us. [00:11:30] Speaker B: 100 and they did, but at quite some Cost by us, I mean you, Right? [00:11:36] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:11:38] Speaker B: And the victim. And victim I use quite deliberately, was a cosmonaut by the name of Vladimir Komarov. And even before he went up, he knew that he was fucked. Even before the fucking. [00:11:51] Speaker A: Lord, it's like a space kamikaze. [00:11:53] Speaker B: This guy knew he was fucked. There are reports of him telling his friends, if I don't fly, they'll send Yuri Gagarin and I won't kill my friend. He fucking knew, right? [00:12:05] Speaker A: Oh, yes. That's so sad. [00:12:07] Speaker B: Ah, man. And they got all the way to the final fucking hurdle. Launch happened, the docking happened, but it was during re entry when his parachute failed and the capsule that he was in slammed into the ground. Oh, yes. At terminal velocity. [00:12:26] Speaker A: So with 200 issues on this thing, the one that got him was literally. [00:12:31] Speaker B: Parachute. [00:12:31] Speaker A: Just the parachute. [00:12:34] Speaker B: And awesomely, poignantly, his final. His final fucking words were captured on radio. His final words. Vladimir Komarov, this devil ship, nothing I was promised is working. I am burning up. You have killed me. Those were his last words before he fucking crashed into the ground and literally exploded. [00:13:03] Speaker A: I appreciate that. He didn't try to go out on like, poignant, patriotic words. [00:13:07] Speaker B: He was like, it is all for the good of the mother Land, right? [00:13:11] Speaker A: Yeah. Like, no, I. I had to do this. And this sucks. And I hate you all. [00:13:16] Speaker B: Like, he knew on the way up. [00:13:17] Speaker A: All the points to Vladimir here, his name was Vladimir, right? [00:13:21] Speaker B: It was. Yes, indeed. Vladimir Komarov. [00:13:24] Speaker A: Yeah, that is. That is. [00:13:26] Speaker B: What a way to go. What? [00:13:27] Speaker A: And I'm sure he was just this. You know how like my. My Princess Diana is. That one. That one limo crash where I don't quite understand how everyone died in it. Like, people were in this limo and they crashed and everybody just completely smashed, bits or whatever. But I imagine that, like, a lot of people, like, they must have been bits. And that's what I'm thinking here is like, this guy was probably. If you come out of space. [00:13:56] Speaker B: Yes. [00:13:56] Speaker A: Full throttle, like you. He must. They just might have found jelly in that thing. [00:14:00] Speaker B: Oh, completely. He was mangled. He was paced. You know what I mean? He was gas. So four years later, in the ussr. Let's run it back. Let's fucking do it again. [00:14:12] Speaker A: Try it again. [00:14:13] Speaker B: Let's do it again. I correct my previous statement. And it was in fact the Salyut one, that was the world's first space station. And it was after 23 days aboard the Salyut 1, the crew of the Soyuz 11 again making progress. They're getting out there right yeah. And the crew of the Salyut one in 1971 had been on board this fucking station for 23 days. When they were preparing to return to Earth, the crew had undocked. They were ready to take that trip home when a valve, a pressure valve opened at the wrong time, venting the atmosphere of a cabin directly into space. [00:14:58] Speaker A: Oh, no. [00:14:59] Speaker B: At the expense of the lives of three cosmonauts who suffocated in the vacuum of space. Within fucking moments, they suffocate. [00:15:08] Speaker A: Yeah. That had to be like freezing almost in vacuum. That's like what almost happened to Apollo 13, right? [00:15:16] Speaker B: Like that was exactly. [00:15:18] Speaker A: Basically the exact same thing. But they managed to keep that from happening and get back. [00:15:23] Speaker B: Yep. And these three cosmonauts in 1971, Georgi Dobrovolski, Viktor Patsiev and Vladislav Volkov, have the fame, the infamy of being the only three people to ever have died in space itself. [00:15:41] Speaker A: Oh. So outside of the. The ship. [00:15:45] Speaker B: They were in the ship, but the ship depressurized, so they died. Their craft was in space when they died. [00:15:52] Speaker A: So no one else has. [00:15:53] Speaker B: Not that I can see. Nope. [00:15:56] Speaker A: I mean, I guess that makes sense. When I think about, like, the disasters that I do know of. They never happen. Like on the space station. Like, you're. You're fine once you're, like, there. [00:16:05] Speaker B: Yep. Plenty of people have died on the way. Plenty of people have died on the way down. [00:16:09] Speaker A: But actually, I guess that makes sense. Yeah. [00:16:11] Speaker B: Infinite Black itself. Just three hapless Russians have died up there. Wow. Indeed. [00:16:19] Speaker A: And they've got that going for them. [00:16:21] Speaker B: Well, look. Hey, that's something, isn't it? [00:16:24] Speaker A: Right. If you're gonna go out, we can get in the Book of Guinness Book of Records doing it. [00:16:29] Speaker B: Listen, I can think of worse ways to be immortalized. [00:16:33] Speaker A: I think we've talked about many of them. [00:16:35] Speaker B: For sure. For sure. We have another banger, this time to the US in 1967, the Apollo 1. Lots of Apollos. More than you might think. [00:16:47] Speaker A: Well, yeah, we know there's at least 13. [00:16:50] Speaker B: Considering you may or may not know that during a test, just a launch pad test of Apollo 1. All it takes is one fucking spark. A single fucking spark ignited the atmosphere within the cabin, which before launch is Pure oxygen. Pure 100% oxygen, causing absolute, impossibly impossible to contain. Fire tore through the spacecraft. Suits of Velcro and nylon. Yes. The crew trapped inside like fucking tuna in a tin. And three astronauts. Virgil Grissom, Ed White and Roger Chaffee. [00:17:38] Speaker A: That's Gus Grissom. Come on, get it right. [00:17:40] Speaker B: It is indeed. [00:17:41] Speaker A: Yes, very nice. [00:17:44] Speaker B: 30 seconds. Autopsies showed they were completely unconscious even before the flames consumed them. They were burned. They were charred. They were still sat in their seats, buckled into their fucking harnesses. [00:17:59] Speaker A: Man, oh man, it's like the, the. [00:18:00] Speaker B: Paul Walker of, of space disasters. [00:18:03] Speaker A: Yes, yeah, the Paul Walker of space disasters. Just burnt to a crisp in the seat the way, the way you landed. [00:18:10] Speaker B: Now we go further, we have a few more to go and they get more and more fatal. You'll know about Columbia, no doubt. [00:18:19] Speaker A: Sure, yeah. [00:18:20] Speaker B: 2003. This bad boy had been in orbit for 16 days, but little did they know up there circling the blue marble, looking down, death had already claimed them because during launch, during the launch of Columbia, a piece of foam, a piece of insulation foam had broke free of a tank and had struck the wing, gouging a hole which made it kind of structurally non viable. So on re entry, the plasma fucking gas, the superheat penetrates the structure, penetrates the wing, causing what is described as a total structural breakup at 60,000ft above the ground at Mach 18. [00:19:13] Speaker A: That's not great. That's one of those things too that like. Sorry, I'll let you say the dead in a minute. But the, one of the things that always gets me and which is why you would never catch me on something like this, even if it's the end of days, is that like it really is like these tiny little things, you know that like if it were a bigger thing, there would be a system that detected it. Right. Like, you know, you, something would find it, but it's that there can be like some imperceptible thing that nothing catches and that's just a death sentence. [00:19:47] Speaker B: Well, you say that, but after, after Columbia, the, the seven dead. Seven dead, yes, indeed. Seven astronauts dead. And the board of investigations afterwards didn't just blame the foam itself, but also determined that NASA as a whole had a flawed safety culture. [00:20:12] Speaker A: You never want to hear that. [00:20:13] Speaker B: You really don't. [00:20:15] Speaker A: We keep hearing that about like Boeing, stuff like that too. Like you just. [00:20:20] Speaker B: Interestingly, some of the arguments I've heard over private enterprise being responsible for space exploration as opposed to government agencies, people say, you know, those who are advocates of private companies doing space launches, well, we can afford to take a few more risks. [00:20:38] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. [00:20:40] Speaker B: Because of the, you know, less red tape, we can be a little bit more daring. [00:20:44] Speaker A: No, I want all of the red tape tape. When I got get on any form of transportation, I want it taped to, I want it like A mummy. That's how taped up. [00:20:55] Speaker B: If I'm. If I'm. If I'm gonna get in. If I'm gonna get in the bullet. The space bullet. [00:20:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:21:00] Speaker B: Then show me the checklist. [00:21:01] Speaker A: Yeah. I am happy for the bureaucrats. [00:21:04] Speaker B: Yes. In that case, which takes us to Challenger, of course. [00:21:10] Speaker A: Naturally. Yes. [00:21:11] Speaker B: In 1986. These aren't chronological by the way. I'm linking these. [00:21:14] Speaker A: Yeah. By order of. [00:21:15] Speaker B: Yes. [00:21:16] Speaker A: Devastation. [00:21:17] Speaker B: Yes. So Challenger, 73 seconds into the launch. The O rings, baby. Those O rings. [00:21:26] Speaker A: Yep, that's the. We all know the term O ring. I don't know what it is, but I know it's not good when it doesn't. When it fails. [00:21:35] Speaker B: It is a kind of a valve strengthening mechanism on a rocket booster. It failed and allowed red hot fucking gas to leak which ruptured a fuel tank. And the world saw Challenger just completely destroy itself at again 46,000ft. And people say they were alive on the way down, don't they? [00:22:06] Speaker A: Yeah. Which is like the worst. You want them to just like go and be completely unaware. And I remember like learning about this as a kid and being like, sorry, sorry, what. [00:22:17] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:17] Speaker A: Happened. And the idea that it was like when they, this is because they hit water, right? [00:22:22] Speaker B: They did, they, they, they splash landed. [00:22:25] Speaker A: I remember someone, maybe my dad, maybe my teacher, someone explaining that like oh, hitting water is like hitting a wall, like a brick wall at this, you know, when you're coming and fast. And that like stuck with me my whole life was just the idea of like smash like that and being aware the whole way. [00:22:47] Speaker B: Absolutely chilling to think that there is a possibility that some of those seven were conscious until they fucking crashed into the Atlantic. [00:22:58] Speaker A: And like you said, like everyone was watching. Were you, were you watching? Do you remember this like at the time or just more like retrospect. [00:23:07] Speaker B: Is it a memory or a memory of a memory? [00:23:10] Speaker A: Right. Yeah, exactly. Because everyone says they were watching it. [00:23:13] Speaker B: I definitely saw on the tv. Definitely saw it on the tv. I remember that vividly. But I don't know if it was at school in my class, but I vividly remember seeing the Challenger blowing up on telly. And they wouldn't have, you know, they wouldn't have replayed that event. [00:23:28] Speaker A: Well, that's a good point. Yeah. They wouldn't have re. Aired it. Yes, not at that time. Now they will. We've seen much worse things on television this week. Yeah, right. Exactly. At the time though. Yeah. They wouldn't have been like, hey, do you guys want to relive this trauma every five Minutes like we do now. Yeah, like, it's. I don't know, it's a lot of the, like kind of, you know, when you talk about millennial trauma and whatnot, like you always point to like. Yeah, we went to school one morning and watched the Twin Towers blow up. You know, and for Gen X, this is. They are like, you know, if you want to know why we're messed up. We all sat in our classrooms and watched a beloved teacher explode. Yeah. [00:24:13] Speaker B: Christ. Yeah, it's rough. Hey, listen, let's. Let's go to China, shall we? [00:24:18] Speaker A: Okay. Yeah. Hey, we haven't hit them yet. [00:24:20] Speaker B: An absolute banger here from 1996. Talk about private enterprise. This is the Xijiang satellite launch catastrophe. A rocket carrying a private comms satellite, right. Seconds after takeoff, veered wildly off course and slammed into a fucking village. [00:24:49] Speaker A: I was gonna say, how does a satellite kill people? Nobody's on that. [00:24:53] Speaker B: The rocket that it was on, the rocket was carrying the satellite. This is a long known as a March 3B rocket carrying. [00:25:00] Speaker A: So it was. [00:25:02] Speaker B: Let me see. [00:25:04] Speaker A: Because I mean, as a satellite, they probably just launched it, Right. The issue is that it hit a. [00:25:08] Speaker B: Village, not the launch satellite. [00:25:10] Speaker A: Yeah. So no one was on it, right? [00:25:12] Speaker B: Well, no, but they were fucking so many people in the village. [00:25:16] Speaker A: Yeah, that was when you first introduced. You were like a satellite. I'm like, but nobody's on a satellite. [00:25:20] Speaker B: Yes. Launching a satellite into orbit. Yes, yes, yes, I see. [00:25:24] Speaker A: It went awry. [00:25:26] Speaker B: Yes. And essentially became a missile. [00:25:29] Speaker A: Jesus. [00:25:30] Speaker B: Hundreds of tons of propellant smashed into this village on a hillside overlooking the launch site. It being China, of course, official records, are they. Well, the official. Officially China said six dead. Right. But the devastation of this village site, you know, accounts vary between dozens or even hundreds killed. We're talking flattened houses, incinerated, civilians in their houses, rubble. Just an absolute clusterfuck. Just launch a rocket with a satellite on it at a town. [00:26:13] Speaker A: Yeah, right. That's bombing a town. [00:26:16] Speaker B: Yeah, Completely that. Completely that. Leading us to what I believe to be the most lethal space faring accident of all time. We're back in the USSR. This is the Netherland catastrophe in 1960. So early, isn't it? [00:26:37] Speaker A: It's like, were we seriously doing that in 1960? What in the world? [00:26:42] Speaker B: The space center earlier on talked about. I can't remember the guy's name, but the Nazi. Werner von Braun. Braun, yes. All of these rockets were based on his designs still. [00:26:53] Speaker A: That's right. Yeah. [00:26:54] Speaker B: All of this shit is just based on his drawings, his Nazi sketches. [00:27:00] Speaker A: Fucking like Think about how close you are to like just the invention of air travel. [00:27:06] Speaker B: Yes. [00:27:06] Speaker A: When Werner von Braun is coming up through space travel, I think it's like 19. Oh. Not 1916. I don't know, it's on a license plate here, but it's somewhere in like the tens. Ish. I think so. We were like so big for our britches to be like, you know what? We just figured out how to like get people from point A to point B. Why don't we just shoot them into space now? It's crazy. [00:27:35] Speaker B: Oh God. Do you see why I love it so much? So again, much like in China, this is a pre launch catastrophe. We are at Baikonur Cosmodrome and this is a missile test that we. [00:27:48] Speaker A: Cosmodrome is a good word, isn't it though? [00:27:51] Speaker B: I would like to. It feels like somewhere you'd like go roller skating. [00:27:53] Speaker A: And there's like a. I was about to say like that's the kind of joint that's got some roller skating. It's got some cosmic bowling jam. [00:28:02] Speaker B: Exactly. But not here. No. Because. [00:28:05] Speaker A: Yeah. No. [00:28:08] Speaker B: Political pressure. Economical pressure. Corners were cut, safety warnings were ignored. And as the launch checklist. As the. The launch got near, just hundreds of military folk and engineers were crowded around this rocket until at quarter to 7pm on the day of the launch, the engines fired prematurely and a fully fucking fueled missile with hundreds of people gathered around it detonated at once. Spraying propellant, spraying fucking burning fuel in a colossal fireball. I read that it can the fucking. That the mix contained nitric acid. [00:28:59] Speaker A: Oh fun. [00:29:01] Speaker B: All over the launch pad, killing between. Reports vary between 80 and 130 people just watching. Instantly killed or immediately afterwards in the inferno. Vaporized on the spot. People were burned alive. People were trapped under debris. [00:29:19] Speaker A: My God. [00:29:21] Speaker B: There are quotes from survivors. Fucking hell. Who Describe the smell of quote, burning meat and acid. [00:29:31] Speaker A: Oh. [00:29:33] Speaker B: In the air. [00:29:35] Speaker A: That is horrific. Yeah, so I guess, yeah, like you would think that like the smell of like chemicals and stuff would overwhelm it, but if there's like a hundred bodies all burning at once, it's gonna smell like the most vile barbecue. [00:29:49] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's known as the Nedelin Catastrophe after one of the cosmonauts who died. Who? [00:29:56] Speaker A: He what? They name it after one, I guess. [00:29:59] Speaker B: Just pick one. I don't fucking know. But he was incinerated in the fucking chair he sat in. [00:30:07] Speaker A: It's probably the best of the ways. [00:30:08] Speaker B: To have gone covered in that whole posse. Burning nitric acid. That's Again, again, if you gotta go. [00:30:16] Speaker A: Hard. So adding to, not only will I not be going to space, but I'm not watching any launches either. It's like, you know how I talked about in the one where I told you about the race car deaths? Yeah, sure, sure, sure. You know, my mother was always, don't go to those. Someone always died. I know you love that one. I felt. I was pretty proud of that. But, you know, my. My mom had always said, like, oh, I, yeah, I don't go to race car to races because someone always dies. And someone doesn't always die, obviously. But it is one of those things where it's like, you know, people do, and sometimes the crowd dies and it's like, is it really worth it to like, maybe. I don't know. I don't know. I'm not interested enough. I can watch it from television and that's fine. I don't need to. To be where the space thing is. [00:31:06] Speaker B: And there's the fucking question, isn't it? Is it worth it? [00:31:10] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:31:11] Speaker B: Folks, we are never getting to Mars. [00:31:15] Speaker A: No. Oh, absolutely not. No matter what Elon tells you, we're not fucking going. [00:31:20] Speaker B: Fucking getting beyond the moon ever. [00:31:22] Speaker A: Right. [00:31:23] Speaker B: At the rate we are killing ourselves down here. [00:31:27] Speaker A: Right. [00:31:27] Speaker B: We ain't getting off this planet. [00:31:30] Speaker A: When the future historians dig up this podcast, wherever they're gonna go, it's. They're right. When we never got to Mars. [00:31:37] Speaker B: Right. Let me quote directly from my notes, if I may. [00:31:41] Speaker A: Yes, please do. [00:31:43] Speaker B: Look at these nerds. Oh, mise en scene. [00:31:46] Speaker A: I don't think anyone has ever said mise en scene in such a horny way before. [00:31:50] Speaker B: The way I whispered the word sex. Cannibal recently. [00:31:53] Speaker A: Worst comes to worst, Mark, I'm willing to guillotine you for science. [00:31:57] Speaker B: Thank you. That's really, really sweet. It's cold outside, but my pancreas is talking to me. I'm. I'm going to leg it. [00:32:03] Speaker A: You know how I feel about that, Mark. [00:32:05] Speaker B: I think you feel great about it. Listen, Jack, I'm just going to start. Oh, okay. You can. [00:32:13] Speaker A: He looks so disappointed. [00:32:16] Speaker B: Oh. [00:32:17] Speaker A: Oh, okay. [00:32:18] Speaker B: Yeah, go ahead. [00:32:18] Speaker A: You want to. Mark, I have a question for you. [00:32:23] Speaker B: Let me just have a little bit of my drink. [00:32:26] Speaker A: Okay. Well, I do want you to be prepared. [00:32:28] Speaker B: Would you like to know what I'm drinking? [00:32:31] Speaker A: Sure. [00:32:32] Speaker B: This is Dr. Pepper Vanilla Float flavor. [00:32:35] Speaker A: It does sound nice. [00:32:36] Speaker B: So nice. [00:32:37] Speaker A: Anyway, I wonder if we have that. [00:32:39] Speaker B: Well, I think, I think. I think you actually do because the place I buy it from, it's in American cans, it's imported. [00:32:44] Speaker A: Oh, interesting. Have to Give that a look. Although is it diet or is it regular? [00:32:49] Speaker B: It is regular. [00:32:50] Speaker A: Unfortunately, I can't drink that. My body would reject that an instant. [00:32:53] Speaker B: But Mark, question. Come on, hit me. [00:32:56] Speaker A: Are you right with the Lord our God? Are you down with the God? Have you made your peace with Jesus Christ? [00:33:08] Speaker B: I have not, in fact. And on the day of my death, he's got some fucking questions to answer. [00:33:18] Speaker A: Well, I've got some bad news for you, Mark. [00:33:21] Speaker B: Go on. [00:33:23] Speaker A: Because in two days, Jesus is coming. [00:33:26] Speaker B: Oh, cool. [00:33:28] Speaker A: The Rapture is happening, Mark. The whole Internet is talking about it. [00:33:31] Speaker B: No. [00:33:33] Speaker A: Yeah, Yep. It's supposed to be happening on September 23rd. Some idle Tuesday. [00:33:39] Speaker B: That's really soon. [00:33:41] Speaker A: It is really soon. Yeah. Apparently, according to an article, and there's many articles about this. I started seeing folks talk about this a few weeks ago and I didn't quite like get that this was like a conversation, you know, I didn't know that like the Internet was. Was up in arms about this. As you all know, I don't use the tiktoks. And that's where everyone has been spreading the news and the warning. But apparently religious leaders are now convinced. This is an MSN article. Religious leaders are now convinced that the second coming of Jesus Christ is imminent, arriving within mere days. This comes as biblical prophecy has been discovered that could herald the beginning of the Rapture. [00:34:26] Speaker B: Nice. [00:34:28] Speaker A: The day of judgment may arrive on September 23rd, and believers are turning to sacred texts, seeking their deliverance. This apparently came from an African pastor. This was the. A South African pastor, I should say. Okay, I, I guess be specific. That's still Africa. A South African pastor said he had a vision that this was going to happen on the 23rd. His name was Joshua Mahla Kella. Okay. He said the rapture is upon us whether you are ready or not. And has been sort of deciphering various signs that the end times are coming. And this has, for whatever reason, like caught fire on Tick Tock and things like that, where people are like this. This is for sure. Which, you know, speaks to why I do not like these websites and whatnot. People are like freaking out, wondering what, what is Jesus gonna let them take their dogs with them? This seems to be a big conversation that people are having on the social media. But apparently the tribulation is coming and we are about to be left behind while all the Christians are taken and we're gonna have to fight all of the terrible things from the Rapture separated from God for however long. This so takes I. [00:35:58] Speaker B: A couple of. A couple of thoughts. A couple of issues with that. I mean you aren't. I mean I do tick tock, right. I tick tock. In fact, it's one of the reasons why I. I don't know if I said this on while we were recording last week, but it's one of the reasons why I don't particularly want the new iPhone because I want to be reducing my screen time. [00:36:16] Speaker A: Yes. [00:36:17] Speaker B: Committing to more of it. [00:36:19] Speaker A: Yep. [00:36:20] Speaker B: The just the stupidest air quotes catches fire on tick tock on a weekly basis. Right. So quite why this has I don't know. But from a religious point of view, I feel now more than ever signs of the Rapture are kind of ten a penny. [00:36:38] Speaker A: Oh sure. Well, and they, they always have been. And to be clear when I say always, we talked about this on the Fan Cave. So if you subscribe to our Kofi, you can learn in depth about where Rapture theology came from because I talked about it last week when we talked about the Omen. Ko-fi.com jackwallgraves but the rapture theology is new, right? It's only been around for 130. Well, if you go like all the way back to the roots from like the 1860s didn't really catch until the early 1900s though. So, you know, when a pastor got hold of it here in America, it started in Britain, got hold of it in the early 1900s and spread this whole thing. So keeping in mind that this is new theology ever since then, you know, you've got World War I, World War II, Korea, Vietnam, 9, 11, you know, desert Storm, you've got abortion, you've got gay marriage, you've got earthquakes, floods, famines, Covid. Like at any given time in that century and a half that people have been talking about the Rapture, it. The signs of the times have always been there. [00:37:56] Speaker B: So you'll forgive me if I don't think that, you know, this is the. [00:37:59] Speaker A: One that he's decoded it. No, that this South African pastor hasn't disclosed it. Also, the book is very clear and says that no one knows the hour. There's not like, okay, except for this one neat trick where you can figure it out. [00:38:14] Speaker B: So would. Would claiming to know the hour, would claiming to have figured it out, would that not mean, would that not instantly get you left behind, even if you. [00:38:22] Speaker A: No, I don't think that that's. I mean, because how evangelical Christianity works is that, you know, you're saved. You're saved. So you can't like, you know, if I lied 10 minutes before Jesus came, he wouldn't be like, oh, you sinned. Guess you're not coming with. It's. Once you're saved, you're saved, you're forgiven of your sins. Jesus took all that. So. No, you could. You can make false claims about the Rapture or whatever. [00:38:51] Speaker B: So I could. I could go on a kill crazy rampage like, an hour before the Rapture, but if I had. [00:38:56] Speaker A: Yeah, technically, you're fine if you had Jesus. And that was the whole thing with, like, Ted Bundy, right? Like, all of a sudden getting all cozy with focus on the family right before he died. Yeah. You just kind of, you know, as long as you accept Jesus. I don't know. I don't even. Maybe it gives you a stern talking to up there or whatever. Like, listen, I'm gonna let you in. But you're. [00:39:19] Speaker B: I'm fucking watching you. [00:39:20] Speaker A: Yeah, you're thin ice, buddy. But just FYI, everyone. Well, you know, you got two days to talk to the big man. [00:39:30] Speaker B: Will we be able to record Joag in the other place? Oh, we'll be left behind anyway. So we're fine. [00:39:36] Speaker A: Yeah, we'll be. It's not really a question, is it? [00:39:38] Speaker B: No. And so will you, listener. [00:39:43] Speaker A: Not everyone. We have. We have a few listeners of. Of faith here who might make it. Yeah. But not many. [00:39:51] Speaker B: Let me say that you are welcome also. All are welcome. Right? Because that's what jog is. It isn't a podcast. It's a living document of the end times. Corey and I, we aren't just your podcast hosts. We're your friends. Do you see what I'm doing? [00:40:12] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:40:13] Speaker B: Do you see what I'm doing? [00:40:14] Speaker A: You're machine learning our podcast. [00:40:16] Speaker B: It's fucking everywhere. It's everywhere. [00:40:21] Speaker A: Everywhere. We've started keeping records of where we see the. It's not this. It's this. That is the AI tell. [00:40:31] Speaker B: And. [00:40:32] Speaker A: And it's incredible. [00:40:33] Speaker B: It. I don't know if it's like the red car phenomenon playing out or what. [00:40:38] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. Like now you notice it, but just. [00:40:41] Speaker B: In case it's passed you by, listener, one of the crystal clear blatant fucking ball bag out on display tells of GPT authored text. Is that particular turn of phrase. It isn't this, it's this. [00:41:00] Speaker A: Yes. [00:41:01] Speaker B: And when you notice that, when you know that as soon as you see that phrase, it's written by AI, you see it everywhere. Just in the last week alone, I've seen it in work, I've seen it on social media. You've seen it from your students. I've seen it in news advertisements, advertisements. [00:41:20] Speaker A: All over the place. [00:41:22] Speaker B: Phrase. It isn't this, it's this. It's everywhere. [00:41:29] Speaker A: It's such a better tell that. You know, everyone's like, oh, look for EM dashes. And it's like, I use EM dashes. I come from an academic background. [00:41:36] Speaker B: I love an ellipse. [00:41:36] Speaker A: It's not this, it's this. Yep, that's. That's your Gen X in you. Gen Xers love the ellipses. [00:41:43] Speaker B: Yeah, but the. [00:41:44] Speaker A: It's not this, it's this. And then often followed by something in triplicate, you know, like. [00:41:49] Speaker B: Oh, really? [00:41:50] Speaker A: Yeah, like, you know, it's combining. Like, I'm trying to think of, like, you know, it combines. [00:41:55] Speaker B: It's not X, it's white. It does this and this and this. [00:41:59] Speaker A: Right? Like, it combines pathos and ethos and logos, you know, like something like that. You know, it's like that thing of threes which we learn to do, right? Like, that is like something we learn is like a style or whatever, but, like, AI does it consistently. It's not this. Combining this, this and this. [00:42:18] Speaker B: It's as blatant to tell as, like, six fingers on a hand, isn't it? [00:42:23] Speaker A: Right? Yep, 100%. [00:42:25] Speaker B: Oh, man. So good. [00:42:28] Speaker A: Sometimes I'll get, like, you know, almost all the way through, like, a student paper, and I'm like, it's fine. Like, it's well written or whatever, you know, and then it gets to that and I'm like, hold on. And then I go back through and I'm like, yeah, no, yeah, no, I see it. I see it all there. It's like the. The tell that makes you think. Think. You know, it's not that no one ever uses this turn of phrase, but it is the one that makes you go, I should reread this and see if there were other ones. [00:42:55] Speaker B: And it sounds like advertising copy, doesn't it? [00:42:57] Speaker A: It sounds like it does, yeah. [00:43:00] Speaker B: Advert copy. [00:43:01] Speaker A: Right. You start to realize, like, really how much. I mean, it feels like the kind of thing that the, like, douchebag tech guy gets up and gives a presentation in, like a. A movie sort of thing. It's not just this. [00:43:15] Speaker B: It's a standing ovation. [00:43:16] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, right. Like all the. All the AI talks, like Elon Musk, you know. [00:43:24] Speaker B: Fascinating. [00:43:24] Speaker A: That's fun. Yeah, it's everywhere. Everywhere. Now report back, like, please send us your screenshots and things like that, because now you're gonna notice it everywhere. [00:43:32] Speaker B: The second you see one of those, just screen, screen, grab it, put it on Facebook. Or Discord, whichever one you use. Or Blue Sky. We can be found there often. I love. I'd love to know just how widespread it is. I love it so much. Yes. Welcome to another week, another episode of the only podcast that matters, the only podcast that you really feel an emotional connection to. Let's face it, let's be honest. There are other podcasts you listen to. I've come to make peace with that. But none of them, none of them give you what we give you, do they? None of those other podcasts just fire that synapse, releases that dopamine in a way that we do, do they? They don't leave you grinding your teeth and wondering when you can listen to them again. They don't give you that, do they? They're the podcast. They're not a monkey on your back like we are. A voice in your head like we are. We're not just a podcast. We're an addiction. And you're in deep, mate. Hey, aren't you, you fucker. [00:44:43] Speaker A: I went to a show the other day, and it was. It was. Bayside is like, my favorite band, and they had a 25th year. Like, they're on a tour. It's called the eras tour. See what they did there? [00:44:57] Speaker B: Oh. [00:44:59] Speaker A: E R A S. Okay. Yes. As opposed to that one, Blonde Girl's tour. [00:45:06] Speaker B: Yeah, I think my version would have been funnier. The Errors Tour. I'm sure somebody must have done that. [00:45:10] Speaker A: What was yours? [00:45:11] Speaker B: Errors. Like mistakes, E R R O R S. The Errors Tour. [00:45:15] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, that's what I mean. It was the Errors Tour. Sorry. Yeah, that was what I meant. It was the Errors Tour. So anyways, so I go to the Errors Tour of Bayside, and they have a. An opening band, and I think they were called the Sleeping, and they were like. They were pretty good, you know, kind of a screamy, early 2000s melodic rock hardcore situation, you know, in the vein of, like, Bayside. But maybe a little like, if you cross, like, Bayside with, like, an under oath or something like that, a little more like. And, you know, I was like, they're fine, but they. Their vibe was like 2003 in, like, the wrong way where. And you reminded me of this just it. Just now. Because it was like that thing where you'd get up there and be like, you know, all right, now, mosh you and stuff like that. And it's like, I just feel like when you're. When you're 45 and you're calling your. Your audience feels like, so try hard I like it like, you know, it's like, you can. He's clearly been doing this since he was 20 and has the same exact, like, stage presence. Yeah, the same bit. And I was like, it just feels like maybe you should have grown out of that a little bit. Which leads to what was also very funny here, which was like, the anti 2003 is there was a pit going in this, and I was on the, like, balcony looking down at it. And like, they were the whole time, you know, huge pit, lots of. Lots of moshing, lots of crowd surfing the whole thing. But at the end of, like, you know, a song, especially if it, like, raged really hard, the guys would, like, go and, like, hug and kiss each other. [00:47:04] Speaker B: Oh, that's nice. [00:47:05] Speaker A: And I was like, this is not like the homophobic 2003 where they would have been like, you, dude. It was like strangers just going to be like, hey, good job, man. Give him a little. Little kiss on the cheek. It so delightful. It's like. I love it. Makes me think, listen, everything's not terrible. [00:47:24] Speaker B: One of my favoritest online videos of all time, and it's one that can't easily be explained or classified. Have you seen, okay, the British kids in a garden in, like I say, a garden, like a backyard, okay. Of someone's home. I think I'm going back maybe five years, maybe a little more. And they've clearly been drinking their drinks, bottles all over the place. And they're smoking cigarettes. And they're naked from the waist up. They're all stripped from the waist up. [00:47:57] Speaker A: Okay. And these are so shirtless. [00:47:58] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's what I'm saying. [00:48:01] Speaker A: Naked just sounds like more extremely. Yeah, okay. [00:48:05] Speaker B: Aggressively shirtless. [00:48:07] Speaker A: Aggressively shirtless. Yeah. All right. [00:48:09] Speaker B: And I'm sure people fucking listen to this. Will know the video I'm talking about. I'm gonna share it with you immediately after this. [00:48:18] Speaker A: Okay? [00:48:20] Speaker B: The one kid finishes his drink and his mate comes up to him and gives him a lovely kind of brotherly, tender little kiss on the mouth. Gives him a little peck on the mouth like a, everything's gonna be fine, dude. And then voluntarily and with full consent of all parties, absolutely smashes him across the back with a fucking patio chair. Just fucking smashes him. Like, they're obviously maybe in a kind of a regional kind of provincial British jackass kind of way. [00:48:52] Speaker A: Oh, okay. Gotcha. Yeah. [00:48:54] Speaker B: And it's just this absolute crazy juxtaposition of this beautiful little, little kissy kiss he gives him and then just damages the fuck out of his spine with A chase. [00:49:05] Speaker A: I mean that is very like in the spirit of Jackass. Right? Like all of those guys always talk about how like it's important that like this show is like very gay in its way, you know, like it is, it is clear that like for them, positive masculinity involves being like, yeah, yeah. [00:49:21] Speaker B: Yeah, you know, yeah. [00:49:22] Speaker A: Physically affectionate. [00:49:24] Speaker B: Yes. [00:49:25] Speaker A: While also beating the. Out of each other and doing insane stuff. So I like that, I like that as a. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You'll definitely have to send that to me. [00:49:32] Speaker B: Yes, I shall. Let me see. Couple of bits, couple of bits. A few orders of business, if I may. Some really nice kind of validatory listener interactions this week. Yeah, it, it is, it is kind of very pleasant and very rewarding every so often to hear from listeners and to know that you're out there, you know, you're out there and you're listening. And all bits aside that you, you, you kind of feel what we're doing still after all this time. [00:50:02] Speaker A: Truth. [00:50:03] Speaker B: And to just touch back on a few stories that we've done in, in days and episodes and years gone by. Firstly, I want to fucking throw them up for Steven Root and to Eileen. In fact, a few of you seem to have enjoyed just how much I'd lost my shit over the. Apparently way more commonplace than I thought it would. It was act of parthenogenesis in the animal kingdom. It completely blew my mind that that happened. And what Steven Root has shared. A doctor and a man of science, by the way. [00:50:38] Speaker A: True. Yes, that is very true. [00:50:40] Speaker B: Let's not fuck around here. Our audience is a very elite and select and cultivated and learned group of doctors and people of science and medicine. And also freaks and cannibals. [00:51:00] Speaker A: Right, sure. Naturally. [00:51:02] Speaker B: That's you. [00:51:02] Speaker A: That's who you go hand in hand. [00:51:04] Speaker B: And what Stephen Root shared with us over on Blue sky was a particular species of lizard known as the New Mexico whiptail. Right, The New Mexico with his whippy tail. Exactly. This which is a female only species of lizard. What it is, they are all female. It is in fact Wikipedia tells me the official reptile of New Mexico. [00:51:32] Speaker A: Interesting. [00:51:33] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:51:33] Speaker A: Okay. [00:51:34] Speaker B: Which implies that all the other states have a official reptile. [00:51:38] Speaker A: Official reptile. I do. Often when I hear the state X, I'm like, do we all have that? And who. It's just like the herpetologists came together in committee and we're like, you know, this place. They, you know, each state has its thing. But actually I want to look up, see, while you talk, I'm going to. [00:51:54] Speaker B: Look up The New Mexico whiptail is the official state reptile of New Mexico and is all female and is entirely parthenogenetic. They. They don't need. They don't need no man. [00:52:07] Speaker A: Our state reptile here in New Jersey is the bog turtle. [00:52:11] Speaker B: Yeah, figures. [00:52:13] Speaker A: It's one of the smallest turtle species in North America. [00:52:16] Speaker B: Nice. Pathogenic. I think not. [00:52:18] Speaker A: No, no, I'm afraid not. But go on, go on with this. All female. [00:52:22] Speaker B: I'm done with that. All female and just all. [00:52:25] Speaker A: And that's just how they reproduce. [00:52:26] Speaker B: And that is just how they reproduce. Which, you know, again, to quote Wikipedia, it is one of many lizard species known to be parthenogenetic. [00:52:34] Speaker A: Well, you did mention that last time that you were like the. Oh actually no, I think you said like insects were the most common insects and. But reptiles. [00:52:42] Speaker B: Reptiles in captivity as a biological kind of get out clause when. [00:52:46] Speaker A: Blast resort. [00:52:46] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. But it feels like it's more commonplace than I had thought. Which only makes me almost affronted and offended that this isn't widely known, widely taught. [00:53:00] Speaker A: Sure. [00:53:01] Speaker B: Unless it is. And I. Yeah, it might be goofing off that day. [00:53:05] Speaker A: Yeah. To be fair, high school was a long time ago, so. But and like said like they do it is essentially implied in Jurassic Park. Right. [00:53:18] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:53:19] Speaker A: Because they find the. [00:53:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:53:21] Speaker A: Egg that, you know, has some. There's somehow an egg. Even though they. When the dinosaurs don't have any male. [00:53:26] Speaker B: Dinosaurs, everyone's all like, what? Anyway, I love it and I want to thank you very much indeed for sharing that with me, Steve. And yes, parthenogenesis does blow my mind and it will continue to do so even if it is, as it would seem, very common in the animal kingdom. Thank you. [00:53:43] Speaker A: Yes. Let's see what else Brandon on our discord he said at the five year anniversary of Joag. I've gone back to the beginning and started re listening. I am always thrice blessed people who do this. You know, Hannah has done it several times. We have. What is the. Andy is currently doing like a concurrent listen to an episode now in an old episode sort of situation. So amazed, always amazed by people who do that. Especially because like you're just gonna have to listen to us like sometimes because of our terrible memories tell the same stories over and over again. But big ups. I'm curious for doing that. [00:54:26] Speaker B: I'd like to know how like personal anecdotes I've related how they've evolved with. [00:54:32] Speaker A: You know, more elaborate. [00:54:35] Speaker B: What lies might I have stumbled into telling over the last five years? Who knows? None is the Answer. [00:54:40] Speaker A: Yes, but he said he just started episode four, and Mark starts off with Capgras syndrome. [00:54:45] Speaker B: Yes. [00:54:47] Speaker A: Yeah. If you want to explain what Cap gras. Cap Gras delusion is so racking my brain. [00:54:53] Speaker B: It is a delusion which can show up in sufferers of kind of post traumatic injury cte. [00:55:07] Speaker A: Like tbi. [00:55:08] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly, exactly, exactly. And the. The wiring is all up. And it manifests in the belief, the certainty, even when presented with evidence to the contrary, the absolute certainty that those familiar to you, those known to you, your friends, your loved ones, your relatives, are imposters taking the place, body snatchers style of the originals. Whisked away, hidden and held captive by unknown forces, those who are familiar to you and yet aren't. A terrifying fucking absolutely terrifying condition to even consider having. [00:55:46] Speaker A: Yeah, I cannot even imagine this, but unfortunately for someone named BJ Penn from the ufc, he is. Seems to be dealing with this right now. He thinks his entire family has been murdered and replaced with clones, especially his mother. According to his mother. It says Penn has made multiple posts. This comes from Yahoo Sports. This is the article that Brandon linked to. It says Penn has made multiple posts to his social media accounts over the past several months in which he alleges his family members have been replaced by imposters with a particular focus on his mother. There was a request for a restraining order in which it was alleged there was a disturbing pattern of behavior from her son. So this is the mother. After returning from a trip in early May, Shin said she noticed many of her belongings, such as clothes, shoes, jewelry, personal items, and even her bed had all been removed from her bedroom. Shin filed a police report after Penn denied taking the items. She said in. A few days later, her purse with her driver's license, credit card, and locks for herself safe were also stolen. So she set up security cameras inside and out of her house and installed a deadbolt on her bedroom door. She said that pen then took down or tampered with the cameras and also put glue in the deadbolts that stopped her from opening her bedroom door. He stole her mail, aggressively shined a flashlight in her face, sort of held her back from being able to call the police, all kinds of stuff, all because he thinks that she has been replaced with someone who is not his mother. [00:57:33] Speaker B: Incredible. [00:57:34] Speaker A: Incredible. I think obviously no coincidence that this is a ufc. [00:57:39] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:57:40] Speaker A: Fighter and UFC is kind of known for not looking out for the. The people who. Who fight under that company, you know, owned by Dana White, who is a notorious shithead who put on a show that aired After Dynamite a couple years ago, was it called. It was called Slap wars or something like that. I don't remember what, the slap fight. Something like that. [00:58:13] Speaker B: Still happens. It's still on the show. Oh, sure, yeah. [00:58:18] Speaker A: Oh, it is very canceled here. Oh, absolutely not. [00:58:21] Speaker B: Still happens. I don't know if it's gone underground or if it's just parking car parks or what, but. Right. [00:58:27] Speaker A: Like people are gonna do it regardless. But the reaction to it was swift and negative when it aired after aew. The whole premise of this, basically, watch people give each other cte. Yeah. And just watching people wind up and slap the ever loving out of someone else who just sat and took it. That's just. You're just knocking your brain around doing that kind of thing. So, yeah, no surprise that the Cap Gras situation is happening to someone who works for a guy who thinks that's a good idea. [00:59:00] Speaker B: Incredible. [00:59:02] Speaker A: Yeah, very. I mean, it's such like. It's not something that happens all the time. So it's wild to have such a public. [00:59:08] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:59:09] Speaker A: Instance of Capgra. [00:59:11] Speaker B: But the longer we do this, the more these things will come to pass, you know what I mean? The chance of us witnessing these phenomena out in the actual world. [00:59:19] Speaker A: Yeah, it's true. [00:59:20] Speaker B: Yes. It goes up and up and up. I'm here for it. [00:59:23] Speaker A: Yes. Very sorry. To BJ Penn and his family. [00:59:25] Speaker B: Yes. Unlike BJ Penn's mum. [00:59:27] Speaker A: Yes. Did you have another updated. [00:59:32] Speaker B: Nope, that was it. That was it. But do keep him coming, please. If you're listening for the first time, if you're on your second or third run through, if, if anything in the news makes you think, fucking Al Jawak. I've spoken about this. Goddamn. We love hearing about it. We love seeing these things come to pass. [00:59:48] Speaker A: Yeah. And for the record, you know, I keep on saying using the discord is the best way to do this because like, a meta sucks. Also, if you post more than one thing on, like in our group on Facebook, it will just like algorithm, algorithmically sort it out because we don't see it. [01:00:05] Speaker B: Sidebar about meta, just for a second. [01:00:08] Speaker A: Sure. Hit me. [01:00:10] Speaker B: Just one of the rarest and most beautiful pleasures in 2025 is to see a tech company who have invested billions into research and development on a particular product that no one wanted. [01:00:28] Speaker A: Centrist. [01:00:29] Speaker B: And to take this product, which by the way, is not a prototype, it is a ready to ship fucking finished product. And to demonstrate that product in front of the world's media and press and consumers, the globe, the globe wide, and to have it absolutely Shit its pants in the most controlled and stage managed and rehearsed environment possible. If it's ever gonna fucking work, it's gonna work in those circumstances. And it just abjectly fucking failed in front of everybody. [01:01:01] Speaker A: Do you wanna explain what you're talking about? Cause some people probably are not following this. [01:01:05] Speaker B: So look, nobody, no one is asking for AI headwear, fucking facewear, glasses with a display in them. Right? Nobody wants this, right? [01:01:15] Speaker A: Yeah, we are like Google did this, what, a decade ago and was roundly rejected. Yeah, right. We've been through this. It wasn't just a matter of the technology not being there, it was that everyone thought this was a dumb fucking idea. [01:01:28] Speaker B: I've seen people genuinely get use and utility out of the current gen of meta glasses just because they've got a camera in them and you can play music on them and make calls. Alright, fine. [01:01:40] Speaker A: I don't like the idea of glasses with cameras in them. I think it should be illegal. [01:01:43] Speaker B: Oh, listen, I completely agree. And you know the fact that they flash a red LED up when the recording is neither here nor there. Sorry. [01:01:51] Speaker A: Because, right, like if I saw that, I'd be like, what the hell is that? I would be like, oh, that person's recording me. [01:01:56] Speaker B: Oh, that's totally fine. [01:01:57] Speaker A: And also, what am I supposed to do about it? [01:01:58] Speaker B: Fuck off. Yeah, yeah, no, so no one. What I can tell you is that no one is asking for glasses that have a display in the corner and that you can interact with this display by means of a wristband which reads your hand gestures so that you can scroll and text a fucking WhatsApp message on your glasses. Right? Nobody fucking cares. [01:02:24] Speaker A: And there's easier ways to do that. [01:02:27] Speaker B: Well, yeah, but, but again, why would you want to. If you, if you need to surreptitiously bang out a little text with your hand under the table when no one's looking, then you probably shouldn't be doing it. [01:02:38] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. [01:02:39] Speaker B: You know, you're probably violating some social code or other. But again, in front of the world, okay, Zuck is wearing these. Fucking ridiculous. Just nothing streamlined or subtle or cool about them at all. They look, they look like, you know, Weezer in 94 would have, would have skewed these glasses for being too on the nose, pardon the pun. Goes to one of his staff in a, in a kitchen, in a, in a kind of kitchen set. And he's got ingredients lined up in front of him and all of the ingredients have got like huge, huge chili oil in huge font on the bottle. And the guys, okay, Stupid glasses. What can I make with these ingredients? And it dies. What can I. Can I make a sauce with this? It comes back to him with some nonsense. They go back and forth for the most uncomfortable 30, 40 seconds until he goes back. Okay, Mark, I'm gonna throw back to you. I guess the WI fi let us down. Meanwhile, the audience are like, ah, fucking hell. Everybody is furiously typing away about what a horrific, embarrassing, multi billion dollar failure it is. And it's so cravenly just a fucking effort to manufacture relevance. You know what I mean? Just to somehow keep growth going in the right direction, keep the charts pointing in the right direction, keep shareholders confident that there's something new. Anything new. There's got to be something new, surely. [01:04:13] Speaker A: And I think, like, the thing about Zuck and you kind of. You get this from like the. The Careless People book that I've talked about a few times, is like, there also comes this point where it's like, he's got so much money that it's like, it's impossible for him to not be a billionaire, right? Like, he's just. He's always gonna be super fucking rich. And he thinks that, like, it's a thing where it's like, now he can't find any, like, joy in his life. And he's like, I need esteem. I need people to think highly of me. Like, that book sort of chronicles his journey into, like, realizing that he isn't like, he can be more than like just some tech CEO guy. And he can, like, influence governments and he can, like, shape world policy. And that, like, really goes to his head. And I think with these ideas, like, just like, with the, like, metaverse, right? Like, he's. He's like, I'm gonna blow people's mind. I'm gonna be known for this and I'm gonna change the world. You know, he thinks he's gonna invent Ready Player one or whatever. And it's like, A, no one wants that, and B, it doesn't work. Like, you are out of touch with what real people want and everyone around you just goes, yeah, man, that's such a good idea. Because, like, you're the money man and you'll fire anyone who doesn't, you know, isn't a total sycophant. Yeah. So it's, you know, watching it there, I think that makes it more satisfying because the reason he's doing it isn't necessarily just line go up it. You know, his ego is riding on this. And when it doesn't work, all the more valid. That's what's crashing? [01:05:50] Speaker B: Yes. [01:05:51] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:05:52] Speaker B: So that was nice. [01:05:54] Speaker A: That was nice. Yeah. It's always good, but yes. So discord. Use our discord is what I was going to say. And just as you know, another manner of business tween out on the KO Fi this week, I've got Ryan joining me for a little extra snacking. We're gonna talk about since, you know, October is swiftly approaching, which is bananas. We're gonna talk about the best books for your spooky season. Not just new books, but like, anything to, you know, get you through your October. So if you're a reader, if you're looking for something that's gonna creep you out or whatever, join us on our KO Fi. We're gonna talk about that on Wednesday on Ryan. [01:06:40] Speaker B: Right, you mentioned Ryan. [01:06:42] Speaker A: Yeah, Ryan. [01:06:46] Speaker B: Not to want to blow smoke publicly. Right. But I am still reading the stack of books that she gave me the last two times that we've met. I'm still reading them and I think of her each time I pick up a new one. I've told her this. Every time I pick up one of Ryan's stack, I silently give her a little thank you and I sent her a picture of me with the book doing the Ryan with a book pose. [01:07:06] Speaker A: The Ryan pose. Yes. [01:07:08] Speaker B: Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful human. Thank you, Ryan, for all the books. [01:07:11] Speaker A: Beautiful. Also a shout out to Gibson's bookstore, of course, where Ryan is, you know, their queen of scream. I ordered, I pre ordered the book American Rapture, which Ryan has suggested many times. It's only been out in hardcover. Not a fan of hardcover books. So I had pre ordered the paperback. Are you not came out last week. Just they're like heavy and cumbersome and I don't like that. Like oftentimes, like I end up bending the, the jacket on it and it stresses me out, I can tell you. [01:07:44] Speaker B: Getting agitated. [01:07:44] Speaker A: I won't dwell just thinking about a book like that. Yeah. So pre ordered the paperback came out last week and I get a, an email from Gibson's and they're like, listen, books here, if you want us to send it out today, we will totally do that. But the author is going to be here in, you know, a month. Do you want us to hold on to it and get it signed for you? [01:08:06] Speaker B: And I was like, no brainer. [01:08:08] Speaker A: Yeah, I've got a stack of books to read in the meantime. No rush, absolutely get it signed. So that was very cool. One of many reasons I suggest getting your books from Gibson's bookstore in New. [01:08:21] Speaker B: Hampshire sick as. [01:08:24] Speaker A: A beautiful thing. Mark do you want to talk about what we watched? [01:08:29] Speaker B: No, but. Well, I do, but before that. Okay, Yeah, I want to talk about what I want to watch. Right. [01:08:36] Speaker A: Oh, okay. Yeah. [01:08:39] Speaker B: Little thing about me, right. I enjoy. Could you call it fanfic? I don't think so could. Because I don't write any of it down. Right, sure. [01:08:52] Speaker A: Headcanon is what you're talking about, but not even that. [01:08:55] Speaker B: It's. It's headcanon. It's. I enjoy. I enjoy in detail mapping out in my head what I think my favorite properties should do next. [01:09:06] Speaker A: Yeah, it's. It's just head fanfic. It's headcanon. [01:09:10] Speaker B: Is it fanfic if you don't write it down? [01:09:12] Speaker A: Well, that's why I'm saying it's headcanon. Because it's in your head. It's not written down. [01:09:15] Speaker B: I do that. I've got some really fucking clear ideas as to what my favorite property should do next. Right. And indulge me. This might bore you. I'm quite prepared for your eyes to glaze over. It's fine. Go and feed your dog. [01:09:29] Speaker A: Do that thing where I just start yawning and crying. [01:09:33] Speaker B: Just openly yawning into the camera while I'm speaking. Super. Super. [01:09:36] Speaker A: I swear it's not because I'm bored. I just don't sleep enough. [01:09:42] Speaker B: So it seems to be de rigueur at the minute. It seems to be the kind of way that genre properties are brought back to life. The prequel series or the Requel series or the Legacy sequel series. Yes. Ever since Bates Motel and possibly even before, this has been a thing. And a 24 have got the Camp Crystal Lake show coming up. Alien Earth is about to have its final episode this week. God damn. Please stick the fucking landing. Please. Last week's was kind of touch and go. You've got a lot of goodwill in the bank, so I'm prepared to let it go. But some of the decisions I'm not down with. Please don't fuck it up. There's a lot to wrap up in that final episode and it's only 45 minutes long. So you know the fucking touchdowns in sight don't crash into the ground in a fight. [01:10:35] Speaker A: I'm gonna listen. I'm gonna wait until you watch it because I'm so behind on it. [01:10:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:10:39] Speaker A: I'm gonna wait until you have watched it. [01:10:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:10:42] Speaker A: And give like your verdict on it to know whether I should commit. [01:10:45] Speaker B: It has been so good that even if it whiffs at the last episode. [01:10:49] Speaker A: Well, but you know, like I haven't been super into it, so I feel like I need to know where it lands to know whether I should invest. [01:10:55] Speaker B: You know, My point being, at least as at time of recording, Alien Earth has been brilliant. And the other property which seems to be getting the series treatment, the TV series version, is Texas, right? [01:11:11] Speaker A: Yes. [01:11:12] Speaker B: Again. Which it seems like a 24 are going to be doing. [01:11:15] Speaker A: Yeah. With this big bidding war, apparently A24. [01:11:18] Speaker B: Seems to be the one, the front runner. Yes. And these aren't just any old properties. RoboCop in Texas, they're the two of the greatest. You know, alongside Elm street, they're my big three. [01:11:30] Speaker A: Mm. [01:11:31] Speaker B: So the idea that they would be coming back in a. In a, you know, in a format like they've made Alien Earth actually fills me with joy and with a little bit of trepidation. Right. But. [01:11:43] Speaker A: Right. [01:11:43] Speaker B: Even if they're as good as they can possibly be, they won't be as good as what I think they should be. They won't be as good as what I've already mapped out in my head. I've got a fucking brilliant, brilliant pitch for both the RoboCop and the Texas show. And I don't care if it actually is brilliant or not. I've already seen it in my head and I loved it. I really enjoyed it. [01:12:03] Speaker A: You've had a really good time. Yeah. [01:12:05] Speaker B: So I'm gonna pitch these to you. And I know that a lot of A24 execs and Amazon execs dial into the show on a weekly basis. I'm giving it to you for free. Right. You can have these pictures. So the RoboCop show. Okay. Doesn't actually feature RoboCop at all. Or maybe in a cameo, maybe towards the end. I don't know. Maybe references for the fans. Fan. Fan Service. So the RoboCop show is called OCP redacted. Right. [01:12:35] Speaker A: Nice. I like it. Good start. [01:12:37] Speaker B: I know. [01:12:41] Speaker A: I wish you could all see how giddy. Mark. [01:12:43] Speaker B: It's called OCP Redacted, and that title came to me earlier on, and it's great. Now, the tone. So if you take a pinch of Succession and a pinch of Mad Men. [01:12:58] Speaker A: Yes. [01:12:59] Speaker B: And let's see reality tv, like Cops. Take some of that. And all of the. The Verhoeven excess and absolute awful, awful violence and satire. Right. Now, the idea being that each episode is from the files of ocp, and it's the story of those forcibly privatizing public services in a different part of the usa. Like they did to the cops in Detroit. [01:13:38] Speaker A: Right. Yeah. [01:13:39] Speaker B: So Maybe in one state they've tried to take over the water company, in another state they've tried to take over like waste sanitation, pest control. And in every case they've got disproportionately violent methods of getting rid of the unions and busting the workforce. Just this kind of capitalistic backhand intent of, you know, enriching their arms division and using technology and weaponry in places where it should. Shouldn't go, like, you know, taking out roaches with nuclear warheads and whatever and that. You've got the bureaucracy in the offices and the careerism and the people kind of backstabbing one another and the, the kind of. The tech always gets the better of them, gets out of control and they just basically make a complete clusterfuck of everything they touch from the files of ocp. OCP redacted. It's like an eight episode show with certain characters, certain themes that are in common. Throw like, you know, the CEO or like a reporter who's following this and putting it all together. That's the Robocop show in my head. OCP redacted. And I think it would fucking own. [01:14:48] Speaker A: I like it. I'm into it. [01:14:50] Speaker B: Good. [01:14:50] Speaker A: I think it's very relevant. [01:14:52] Speaker B: Good. Okay, now the Texas Show. [01:14:56] Speaker A: Yes. [01:14:57] Speaker B: Now the. As you, as you'll know, the Texas timeline is a mess. [01:15:03] Speaker A: That's true. Yes. [01:15:04] Speaker B: Right. It's a mess. [01:15:08] Speaker A: The were you just re watching all. Because I did notice they showed up on your flex all the. [01:15:14] Speaker B: Oh, they've always been there. [01:15:16] Speaker A: Oh, okay. For some reason it just showed up like they were recently added on Texas. [01:15:21] Speaker B: I always, I always like to have Texas within arm's reach, you know. [01:15:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:15:25] Speaker B: So you've got the prime, you've got the OG timeline, which is Texas 1, Texas 2 and Leatherface. Texas Chainsaw Massacre 3 and next gen New Generation. Right. That's your, that's your, that's your prime timeline. That's your base timeline. [01:15:40] Speaker A: Okay. [01:15:41] Speaker B: Then you've got the remake timeline, Texas Chainsaw, Texas Chainsaw, the Beginning and Leatherface Again. Then you've got the Netflix timeline, and I think there might even be another one in there somewhere. Now my show disregards everything except the first two movies. Right. [01:16:02] Speaker A: Okay. [01:16:03] Speaker B: The show is a direct sequel to Texas Chainsaw Massacre 2, which I'm not. [01:16:10] Speaker A: Gonna lie, I think is my favorite. Texas Chainsaw Massacre. [01:16:13] Speaker B: Depending on what day you ask me. It's mine too. [01:16:16] Speaker A: Right. Yeah. [01:16:17] Speaker B: And that should tell you all you need to know about how much I enjoy Texas. Access to. It's brilliant. [01:16:21] Speaker A: Yes. [01:16:22] Speaker B: And the show is called the Last Roundup. [01:16:26] Speaker A: Okay. [01:16:26] Speaker B: And it follows the rolling barbecue, the rolling grill, you know, the van. He's got the. The food van. It follows the last roundup, rolling barbecue, as it goes from city to city in Texas. Going to food fairs and, you know, county fairs and days out and whatever. And in each city they go to, they have to fucking do the massacre to get the meat. [01:16:53] Speaker A: Of course. [01:16:54] Speaker B: Right. [01:16:54] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:16:55] Speaker B: And it's in timeline. It's a period piece set in 80s Texas against the backdrop of the kind of Vietnam hangover. Reaganomics. [01:17:07] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:17:07] Speaker B: You know what I mean? 80s music. [01:17:09] Speaker A: The serial killer. Panic. Stranger Danger. [01:17:13] Speaker B: Exactly, exactly, exactly, exactly. Tonally, obviously, horrifically gory, funny kind of recurring characters. Again, there's a cop who's joining the dots. [01:17:28] Speaker A: It feels like a little like a. Like Wolf Creek with humor, like the Wolf Creek series, but with. [01:17:34] Speaker B: There's also a little poker face in there. It's. It's okay. It's. It's wry and funny and self aware. [01:17:41] Speaker A: Mm. [01:17:42] Speaker B: But every. Every episode is obviously a different state, a different story, a different massacre. [01:17:48] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:17:49] Speaker B: But there's a cop on their tail. You know, there's a reporter on their tail. Fucking just crack this. Holy. This is. This is a massacre. It's the last roundup. And that's the show. The last roundup. That's the Texas Chainsaw Massacre series. [01:18:03] Speaker A: I like that. [01:18:04] Speaker B: They're great. [01:18:04] Speaker A: I'm into it. And. Because, like, I mean, the thing is, given everything else, you know, that they don't get caught. You have that, like, in the first season, I think of Wolf Creek, how you have the cop who's on the tail the whole time, who. You're like, he's gonna get him. He's gonna get him, and then he just gets horribly murdered. Partway through of it, you have this opportunity to just be so bleak with it. [01:18:33] Speaker B: But what you can also lean into is the fact that every movie in the series has, like, its own family, really. There's different family members coming and going. Let's lean into that. Maybe. [01:18:43] Speaker A: Sure. Yeah, maybe. [01:18:44] Speaker B: They're almost like different families tucked away in different cities and towns around Texas. So Drayton Sawyer links up with one of his families in this city, and they do the massacre and sell the meat. Yeah, that's the show. [01:18:58] Speaker A: I like it. I'm on board with that one, too, I feel. Two great ideas. [01:19:02] Speaker B: Good. And finally. Finally. So I am also something of a gribologist, let's say. Cryptobiology is. Is a passion of mine. Yeah, I enjoy. [01:19:18] Speaker A: Isn't it? Cryptozoology no, cryptobiology. [01:19:23] Speaker B: All right. I enjoy thinking of the Gribbly life cycle. Famous movie monsters. You know how much I love a mogwai. You know, it's true. [01:19:31] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:19:31] Speaker B: I love to think about the kind of the ifs. The what ifs. Right. Imagine for me, if you will, you're on Netflix and you've got like a six part show that is all in character, it's all a bit. And it's shot and presented as a nature documentary. Right. Like a BBC nature documentary. Planet Earth, you know. [01:19:58] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:19:59] Speaker B: Walking with Elephants or some shit. But every single episode is a nature documentary about a particular famous movie. Gribbly. [01:20:11] Speaker A: Yes. [01:20:12] Speaker B: What a great idea. [01:20:13] Speaker A: I really love this, to be honest with you. Like, I keep thinking, so you know the found footage movie, Butterfly Kisses. Right. That I had you watch ages ago. And for me, what I've talked about many times on this show is that found footage lives or dies, in my opinion, on how believable the people are in it. [01:20:38] Speaker B: Yes. [01:20:39] Speaker A: And in Butterfly Kisses there are parts of this where I genuinely wondered like, did the people not know? Did they really think this was a thing? Because they're so believable. And the idea of like a cryptid or monster based show where these episodes take seriously and have talking heads who take seriously. [01:20:58] Speaker B: Exactly. [01:20:59] Speaker A: The. These animals that we observe them. [01:21:02] Speaker B: Exactly. [01:21:03] Speaker A: I love that. I absolutely love that. [01:21:06] Speaker B: I'm so. I'm so glad because I'm. I'm all in on this idea as well. [01:21:11] Speaker A: They can't have this one. We're writing this one. We are figuring out what studio has the most monsters that'll let us do it. [01:21:18] Speaker B: Important thing is that, that it isn't like generic monsters. Like. Oh, right. [01:21:21] Speaker A: Like actual. Yeah. [01:21:23] Speaker B: Mogwai, Xenomorph graboids can be an episode. [01:21:27] Speaker A: Yes. [01:21:28] Speaker B: You know what I'm saying? Like, it's a love letter to the movies themselves. Something tonally more like, you know, the movies that made us. Or the toys that made us that talk specifically about those. The thing that can be one of the episodes. [01:21:40] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:21:41] Speaker B: And it just follows them. The Predator possibly breeding and nesting and what they eat and how they interact societies. I think that's a fucking great idea. Three great ideas there, crew. [01:21:55] Speaker A: Yeah. Three great ideas. I say the last one is ours. [01:21:58] Speaker B: Okay, cool. [01:21:59] Speaker A: Copyright jack of all. [01:22:01] Speaker B: Jack of all graves 2025. [01:22:04] Speaker A: Yes. Now, do you want to talk about what we watched? [01:22:08] Speaker B: Yeah. We can do. Because we didn't do that last week, did we? So we should have a nice little clutch of movies. Movies here. [01:22:12] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, I still haven't. I've been thinking about this, and I. I think I'm in a weird rut because I don't feel. I don't necessarily feel, like, anxious, per se, but I think, like, on sort of a subconscious level, I don't want to be stressed out, and the world is very stressful. And I found myself, like, not watching a lot because, like, you know, I love a horror movie, but I haven't turned them on because I feel like I am never in the zone where I, like, feel like I want to experience the stress. [01:22:49] Speaker B: Even this time. [01:22:51] Speaker A: Even this time of year. Yeah. [01:22:53] Speaker B: It's spooky. [01:22:54] Speaker A: It is. It absolutely is. And I've been like, huh. Like, I kind of started thinking about this because I just. I haven't been watching a lot, and then the stuff I have watched, I haven't been, like, super into. I think, like, I'm just. [01:23:07] Speaker B: Are you all right? [01:23:08] Speaker A: It's temporary, you know, it'll pass. And especially once October hits and I've got my, you know, skeletons on the lawn and all that kind of stuff, and I'm getting into, like, the. The left column thing, I think is gonna, like, be, you know, watching my Hocus Pocus, my Beetlejuice, and stuff like that. But right now. [01:23:28] Speaker B: He'S gone to a better place. I don't know what to do about it. He's fine. [01:23:33] Speaker A: He's fine. He's with Jesus, you know, picking out who to rapture right now. No. But. Yeah, so I haven't been, like, you know, on the movie vibes, and we haven't watched one together in a minute either, which usually also kind of gets me back in the zone or whatever. So I've watched a few things, but, like, I haven't been going hard like I usually do. [01:23:56] Speaker B: Okay. [01:23:56] Speaker A: You know, in two weeks, I would normally have, like, a long list of flips, but I don't really. This week. [01:24:03] Speaker B: Well, I mean, is that an invitation? Should I pick things up? [01:24:07] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, I have stuff to talk about, but. Do you want to start? [01:24:10] Speaker B: I will. In that case, let me just. Just pull up the old letterbox here. [01:24:16] Speaker A: Well, while you do that, then last night we sat down and we watched Sketch. I've been seeing folks talk about that one. Has that come across your way? [01:24:27] Speaker B: No, I don't believe so. [01:24:29] Speaker A: It is. So it's a. It's a kids movie, essentially, like a family movie about a little girl who. Her mother dies, and she is, you know, with her father and her younger brother, and she's trying to process this. And she's doing so by drawing kind of horrific images, you know, lots of bloody things, people being stabbed, monsters, all that kind of stuff. And so her therapist is like, you know what? You're actually doing a good thing. Like when you think about, like wanting to hurt somebody or whatever, you draw it, you don't do it right. And so she gives her a notebook. But it turns out there's like a magic lake near their house which brings like, fixes things and brings things to life. And her notebook falls in the lake, releasing the monsters that she has drawn. [01:25:17] Speaker B: Now you've described the world. Yeah. Okay. Okay, this does ring a bell. Yeah. [01:25:20] Speaker A: And you know, it's. It's cute and enjoyable. You know, I felt it was like maybe a little slow, dragged a little bit at very left column. It's. It's a family movie. There's like a couple of vague ish swears and that's about it. Like, you know, a grown up character saying Jesus Christ, like that kind of thing. But it's a family movie. The one thing like I was like, this is. Yeah, it's enjoyable, it's cute. You know, it's got a good message about, you know, mourning and, you know, grieving and learning to deal with your feelings and not shove them down, try not to, you know, pay attention to them, stuff like that. But what I did find out afterwards though, is that it's made by a company with like weird right wing ties. They also made the sex trafficking movie. What was that movie? You know what I'm talking about? No, the one that like, it was a huge thing that, like, you know, based on a real guy, Tim something or other, who allegedly went like infiltrated sex trafficking rings. And, you know, all the Christians really got behind this. It's like all fantasy. It's not real. Distracts from like real issues of trafficking. And the guy himself has been accused of sexual assault by like a bunch of people, including ones that he supposedly like saved from sex trafficking. Cry Sound of Freedom. Cry of Freedom. Something like that. [01:26:43] Speaker B: Yes, we've seen that. I've seen Sound of Freedom. [01:26:45] Speaker A: Yes, you've seen it. [01:26:47] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. [01:26:48] Speaker A: Really? How? Have you never mentioned this before? [01:26:51] Speaker B: I think we're looking. [01:26:54] Speaker A: I would remember if you. If you had told me you saw. [01:26:58] Speaker B: Based on what happened with Red Rooms this week. My. I am not a reliable narrator. [01:27:02] Speaker A: Not a reliable narrator. Yeah, but so it's like the same studio that put this out has weird right wing ties. And also I didn't watch the credits really, but apparently it's like a, like advertising some AI company. Oh, okay. I was like, what? Why? On what planet would that have even come across your, like, I don't know, feeds. But anyway, yeah, some. It's like so shilling some AI program for like kids to draw in or whatever and make their stuff move around. I don't know, something like that. So, you know, it's a cute movie and I think in and of itself, like, probably has nothing to do with this other stuff that it's connected to. But you know, word to the wise, if you do plan on watching it. [01:27:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:27:52] Speaker A: Maybe steal it because it sounds like the companies involved in it are sketchy as fuck. Oh, but it's called Sketch. [01:28:00] Speaker B: Feels like my, my boys would get something out of that though. [01:28:04] Speaker A: Yeah. Like, I think it's a. There's actually some parts of it that I think are like genuinely a little scary in it. So, you know, I think it's, it's worthwhile, but just with those caveats. [01:28:14] Speaker B: Okay, okay. I will speak, if I may, on a movie called Masking Threshold. [01:28:21] Speaker A: Okay. [01:28:24] Speaker B: So right off, right out the gate, a movie you will hate. Right? [01:28:29] Speaker A: Okay. [01:28:30] Speaker B: A movie you will absolutely hate. And a movie that I. Oh, I. I awarded three stars too, despite having been really, really impacted by it. You see, I couldn't give it five, but I also couldn't give it one because this is a movie. This is a movie that on paper is everything you would think. Oh, it. Oh, Jesus Christ, Marco's gonna enjoy this. Okay. Very, very non conventional. Right. [01:28:59] Speaker A: Okay. [01:29:00] Speaker B: The entire film is a almost a montage of very, very tight, almost macro photography. Right. [01:29:12] Speaker A: Okay, I'll explain already. That sounds terrible, but. [01:29:15] Speaker B: Oh, right. So the plot is a kind of a low level tech guy, works in like data entry or something similar in a job, suffers with tinnitus. Right? Suffers with a consistent noise in his ear. [01:29:36] Speaker A: It's funny that you just phrased it that way because I was literally about to say like, oh, I just tried to get you to get me a movie called Noise about a guy with tinnitus. And you couldn't find it interesting. But I did find the dvd, so I have to go on. This person has tinnitus. [01:29:50] Speaker B: Yes. And he elects to become a shut in. Almost takes time away from his job and starts to conduct experiments. Right. Starts to approach his tinnitus, firstly from a scientific method. And his experiments become more and more esoteric and his thinking becomes less and less tethered into reality and he starts to work on incredible wild theories, you know? Is the noise that he can hear the sound of cellular life communicating with itself. You know, is it the cosmos speaking to him? Can all animals hear it? As he been excluded from humanity by some force and his experiments become more and more wild, experimenting on himself, on the people around him, on animals. And the entire thing is delivered almost as a monologue. It's him speaking, describing his experiments, describing his experience, becoming progressively more lunatic. The macro photography I talk about is relentless and intimate and very, very well thought of and designed specifically, almost to repel as much as it is to attract close ups of hair follicles and eyeballs and toenails and earwax. I'm serious. You know, pores and follicles and skin and insects, slugs and flies, you know, pixels on a computer screen, typed print. Pop culture references. As this guy gets more and more bonkers and it, and it goes to some pretty fucking intense places by the end. It's, if I were to say words like Lovecraft and Edgar Allan Poe, there's the telltale heart in this, in the DNA of this film as he desperately tries to identify and test and commune and engage with this constant noise in his head and what it might mean. Right, yeah. Now we're in five star territory here. [01:32:09] Speaker A: I was gonna say. All right, so what's the but here? Because it does sound very much your. [01:32:14] Speaker B: At this point we are in five star territory here, but the narrator is the most irritating cunt. [01:32:25] Speaker A: Oh no. Oh no. [01:32:27] Speaker B: Ever been put on screen? This film is. [01:32:31] Speaker A: Oh no. [01:32:32] Speaker B: Dash cams itself. [01:32:34] Speaker A: Oh, okay. Mm. [01:32:36] Speaker B: And I dare say it's intentional. And if it is, well done, pal. But sure, think of the worst redditor, you know? [01:32:44] Speaker A: Uh huh. [01:32:45] Speaker B: Think of the worst fucking YouTuber, you know? [01:32:49] Speaker A: Right. [01:32:50] Speaker B: Think of a griper. [01:32:52] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. [01:32:56] Speaker B: The movie isn't right wing or nor is it noticeably left wing, but in terms of the vibe this guy gives off. [01:33:02] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. [01:33:04] Speaker B: The most irritating in a movie, which is such a shame because I dare say it's intentional and the movie wins in that sense. But I, I found it impossible to really enjoy this film because the guy who is speaking at you, at you for the entire runtime along with this, you know, at points, hypnotic barrage of macro photography, it is overwhelmingly irritating. [01:33:31] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:33:31] Speaker B: And I'm not giving that a five because I didn't, I didn't enjoy it on a fight. But I gotta tell you, man, this ain't something, this movie isn't something that you see often. And I unreservedly recommend seeing it for those who have a little bit of fortitude. And strength places it takes you to the. The last 10, 15 minutes are extreme of. [01:33:54] Speaker A: So it's masking threshold. [01:33:55] Speaker B: Masking threshold given for the. The frequency at which one noise overlaps the noise of another. What's the masking threshold of a particular sound? [01:34:08] Speaker A: It's interesting. Interesting, yes. [01:34:10] Speaker B: The more I talk about it, the more I think I should have given it five, not three. But my thoughts were, what's. Well, if I can't give it a one and I can't give it a five, I've got to give it a three, though, because that's. Yeah, that makes sense. [01:34:23] Speaker A: Yeah. No, I get where you're going with that. [01:34:26] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:34:27] Speaker A: It's a big caveat not being able to stand the narrator. [01:34:31] Speaker B: I hated his guts, but I was supposed to, you know. But at the same time. [01:34:34] Speaker A: Yeah, that's tough. But why did. It's intentional. But why did they make that choice? [01:34:38] Speaker B: Yeah, plus. Plus this movie definitely kills a few living creatures on camera. [01:34:46] Speaker A: Oh. [01:34:49] Speaker B: There are definitely real slugs getting poured salt over. [01:34:52] Speaker A: Oh, no, for sure, for sure. [01:34:55] Speaker B: Yeah, they're definitely real animals with real salt on them. Is that bad? That's bad, isn't it? [01:35:00] Speaker A: I think that's bad. [01:35:01] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. [01:35:03] Speaker A: Shouldn't do that. [01:35:04] Speaker B: Yeah. Three stars for that. [01:35:05] Speaker A: I think you can feel good about not giving it the five stars. I watched beyond the Poseidon Adventure. [01:35:15] Speaker B: Beyond the Poseidon. [01:35:16] Speaker A: Beyond the Poseidon Adventure, which It was on TCM, so I had DVR'd it. And then there's an account on. On Blue sky called Worst Movies Ever. And it just kind of like literally gives the summaries and like the percentage of like, you know, the IMDb score or whatever. [01:35:34] Speaker B: Super quick movies. We went to the Space center earlier with a family that we're friends with, and I had the delight to. Thanks very much indeed, Sam, for showing it to me. But I had the delight in the. In the. In the National Space center of showing a friend of mine the ISS Piss Tank Blue Sky. You know of this? [01:35:54] Speaker A: Yes. [01:35:55] Speaker B: For those of you who don't, if you're on Blue sky, do just search for ISS Piss Tank Tracker, because it will update you whenever the ISS Piss Tank goes up or down, when they take a piss, or when they void the piss that Blue sky will tell you. And it's amazing. I digress. [01:36:12] Speaker A: Very important stuff. [01:36:13] Speaker B: It is. [01:36:14] Speaker A: But yeah, so this Blue sky account is Worst Movies ever. And this came up on it. And I was like, oh, I have that sitting on my dvr. And I was like, well, I just watched the Airport movies. It can't be worse than that. I may have been wrong on this. Beyond the Poseidon Adventure. So if you have never seen the Poseidon Adventure, an early movie that scared the out of me. A movie about a cruise ship that overturns and you're following a group of survivors as they try to get out of this boat before it completely sinks. And they are out of hope and it's terrifying. Lots of deaths, you know, from fire, from drowning, from falling, all of these kinds of things. It's an intense movie. Also very funny at parts. Got a great sense of humor, you know, it's great. So Poseidon Adventure I recommend wholeheartedly. Beyond the Poseidon Adventure is actually kind of an interesting premise where it takes place basically at the same time as the Poseidon Adventure. I like that, but in a different part of the boat. So you're watching same boat. Same boat. Yes, same boat, but just a different group of survivors. And so, you know, we followed this one group, but there's actually this other group in a different part of the boat that we didn't know about. So it's following them. I think that's a great idea. [01:37:43] Speaker B: You know, like, listen, I think that's a fantastic idea. You know that one of my favorite time travel gimmicks is going back and re watching events through a different lens. [01:37:50] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. [01:37:51] Speaker B: If I were to take any issue with that gimmick make, it would be the title. Should it not be like parallel to the Poseidon Adventure or. [01:37:58] Speaker A: Right, yeah, you know, they're probably Poseidon Adventure. Yeah. In other news, in the Poseidon. [01:38:04] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The rest of. [01:38:07] Speaker A: But yeah, on the other end of the Poseidon, like there's. There's other things you could have called this for sure. But that's the least of the issues with this movie. Like, the premise is what's great about it. The extra execution is terrible. Apparently the guy who directed it was a producer. He produced the other one and then he directed this. He also produced Towering Inferno, which is also terrible. And probably a lot of the reasons that you can say Towering Inferno is so bad is because of the producing on it, allowing kind of a whole bunch of interweaving problems outside of the work to get in the way of the work just super quickly. [01:38:47] Speaker B: So right now I've got the news on in front of me and our boy, Charlie Kirk. He's not our boy, is he? He. There's a memorial happening to him right now. [01:38:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:38:56] Speaker B: And Trump has just got up to speak and. Oh, boy. Is He. Behind glass. Oh, boy. Oh, is there some glass in front? [01:39:08] Speaker A: Probably front and back. [01:39:09] Speaker B: Oh, boy. Sorry. Go on. [01:39:13] Speaker A: But so this movie follows this other group, and one of the problems is that this group is very annoying. This is another. What's his face? Timothy. Timothy. No, that's not right. Kane. Michael Caine. [01:39:29] Speaker B: Michael Caine. [01:39:30] Speaker A: Michael Caine. [01:39:30] Speaker B: Oh, is he in it? [01:39:31] Speaker A: Paying for a house movie? Like, for sure. Where he plays the captain of this. This salvage ship that goes in there, and they're trying to, like, figure out if there's some loot they can take from this. Well, there's another group that's a little more sinister, led by Telly Savalas, that is also trying to find loot, which includes plutonium. That for some reason is on this boat. [01:39:56] Speaker B: Well, on the Poseidon. [01:39:58] Speaker A: On the Poseidon. A cruise ship. So that's happening. And meanwhile, you've got, like, Sally Field is, like, sort of your comic relief character, and she is perhaps the most annoying character that I have seen on screen. Like, aside from, like, something like your dash cam or whatever. Like, just. She's so irritating, and it's supposed to be cute, which makes it, like, worse. Like, she's a grown woman and she's acting like a teenager, and it's so irritating. The whole plot makes absolutely no sense. Just. Yeah, it's. It's absurd. Makes a mockery of the Poseidon Adventure. I do not recommend beyond the Poseidon Adventure. Not a good time. [01:40:42] Speaker B: A sequel that actually makes the original worse. That's. [01:40:44] Speaker A: That's rough, right? Yeah, like. And it's a good idea. That's one of the things that's so frustrating about it is, like, that really is a good concept. You know, what if there's, like, a whole group of other people we had no idea were there, and they also have to fight their way out? [01:41:00] Speaker B: Great idea. Such a shame. One that's an idea that's ripe for stealing, for updating. [01:41:07] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. It's like, what else can you do this way? [01:41:10] Speaker B: I think there are other stories to be told in and around, for sure. I will speak of handling the undead. [01:41:17] Speaker A: Mmm. Ah. [01:41:20] Speaker B: So here is a. I think here is a four and a half, in fact, act. O just wonderful, wonderful, wonderful film. And. And it's. Look, it's. It's an undead film. It's a zombie film. Right. But please don't write it off based on that headline. It's Norwegian and subtitled, so that's you out for a start. Plus, it's a zombie film. [01:41:47] Speaker A: Zombies, subtitled. We're not starting. Great. Yeah. [01:41:51] Speaker B: But what we have here is a slow, peaceful, almost beautiful. The. The color palette of this film. It is very calm. The color palette. It. The entire film, even though it isn't. It feels as though it takes Entirely. Takes place at dawn or dusk. It's muted and dreamlike and hazy and slow and like a world that you're just waking up to, you know, it's a very. What's the. There's a word I'm reaching for but I can't quite find. It's a movie that takes place on the edge of. Of your waking mind, almost right in a. In a. In a Norway where, yes, there's been an electrical disturbance and some kind of earth tremor. And yes, in patches, the dead do seem to be returning to life. Right, okay. But that isn't the story. The story is one of grief. And this, The. The story here, this film is asking, what if you could see them again? You know, those that are gone, those you've lost. Often, you know, in. In the most tragic and life splintering of ways, it deals with loss of a child. There is a woman who welcomes back her wife. You know, a married gay couple in like their 60s and 70s. Or if you could see them again, what if they came back, a mother of a young family died. What if you come back and it just poses that question? It's. It's unflinching. The. The one. Like I said, the one plot of a child can't be any more than six or seven after a horrible accident comes back and. And there's horror there where the kid's granddad dresses his autopsy wounds and cleans him and there are flies, you know, horrible, unflinching, but at the same time, just this, this. Even though they're wrong and they've come back wrong and it's different and this is so scary and weird. God, I feel such love. I am so, so glad just to see you again for a moment. You know, that's the question of handling the undead. It's. It's handling grief, really. It's handling. It's that. Right. I put my finger on what this film made me think of. When somebody is gone and you think you see them in a crowd just weeks after, or you. You. You dream of them one night and it's like you've seen them again and you think, fuck, if only I could fucking see them again. That's what this film trades in. It's that kind of. I don't care. I just want to see you again, however brief. [01:44:54] Speaker A: Right. [01:44:55] Speaker B: Great movie. [01:44:57] Speaker A: Nice handling the undead. [01:44:58] Speaker B: Yeah. Great fucking movie. [01:45:01] Speaker A: All of a sudden, a thing just popped up on the screen in front of me that says, confirm your speaking language. [01:45:07] Speaker B: Okay. [01:45:09] Speaker A: It sounds like you might have switched to a different language. Please update it so we can provide a better quality transcription. Vietnamese? [01:45:15] Speaker B: A few times. [01:45:16] Speaker A: Yeah. I think it's struggling to understand your accent today, apparently. Very interesting. Sounds like I watched another movie I didn't like. I went to the movies and I saw one called Bad Shabbos. [01:45:32] Speaker B: Oh, right. Yeah. [01:45:34] Speaker A: Do you know about this one or. [01:45:36] Speaker B: No, I don't. Only the. [01:45:38] Speaker A: Just saw my letter box interaction. [01:45:39] Speaker B: Yes. [01:45:40] Speaker A: Yeah. It's one that comes across like, I thought this was gonna. Have you ever seen Mixed Nuts? [01:45:48] Speaker B: No. [01:45:50] Speaker A: It's a movie from the, like, mid-90s. Steve Martin led. And it's like a. There is this group of weirdos, you know, that all kind of come together in this. It's got Juliet Lewis Scott, Lev Schreiber. It's got, like, all these different people, but, like, they end up with, like, a body in there, like this place. It's like kind of a support center sort of situation. And now they're, like, trying to figure out, like, what to do about this. Right? And it's this very, like, mad cat sort of story of, like, all of these interconnected people who come through this place and their different troubles and things like that. But it's, like, very silly and fun. It's a Christmas and, you know, oh, no, now we've gotten into a pickle. What do we do now? Like, that kind of thing, right? [01:46:38] Speaker B: Sitcom kind of thing. [01:46:40] Speaker A: Yeah, it's like just. Exactly. It's just very silly. Watch these, like, characters interact, you know, learn a little bit about their lives and then, like, watch things go to mayhem. And that's kind of what I expected from Bad Shabbos, which. Which, like, is about a Jewish guy who invites his goy wife or fiance to Shabbos, and this is the first time that her parents are going to meet his parents. So it's like, very stressful situation, but in the process, his weird little brother accidentally kills his sister's boyfriend. [01:47:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:47:21] Speaker A: And they spend the entire movie then trying to figure out how to, like, get the corpse out of the house so that A, they won't be found out by the police or whatever, and B, the non Jewish parents won't find out and it ruins the entire thing. Right. So I was expecting Mixed Nuts out of this. Like, Method man is in this, right? Like, this is gonna be, you know, a fun little romp like where everything goes wrong and oh no, like, what are we gonna do about this body? [01:47:55] Speaker B: It sounds like something that maybe John Cleese would have been in in the, in the, in the 80s. [01:47:59] Speaker A: Totally. Yeah. It's got like, you know, your fish called Wanda or, you know, those kinds of like, vibes. Exactly what I was expecting. Yeah. It's not. It's like so mean spirited the whole time and the family all hates each other and like there's like a weird subplot that like the weird younger brother who accidentally kills the boyfriend, like, really wants to join the idf. Yeah. Like, and it's not really commented upon in any way, like, except that it just keeps coming up and you're like, I don't know what this movie is trying to like say about that. Like, he is a little bit of a sociopath, but it doesn't feel like that's a judgment that it's making about the idf. Like, so that's really weird. But like, everybody is like very mean and like the jokes don't land super well. And it's the filmmaking in it is very bizarre. Like, I think the ultimate way that I think about this is like there's this one scene where, you know, it's Shabbos. So they're not supposed to like do work. Right. And they can't, like, they can't be in a car, they can't use electricity, like all kinds of things like that. And so the dad is trying to grapple with this whole situation of how they're going to get this guy out of the house. But like, you can't lift a guy and carry him on Shabbos. And so he's like, he tells this whole thing about like how you can carry bread on the Shabbos. And so he's going to put like hala on top of the body and then it's fine to transport it because it's like a tray. And so he tells this whole story and it's fine, it's quirky, it's cute, whatever. And Method man is like our argument. [01:49:37] Speaker B: About martyrdom and suicide, mate. That's what this is. [01:49:40] Speaker A: Yeah, right, exactly. [01:49:42] Speaker B: Like your faith to justify atrocities. That's what that is. [01:49:45] Speaker A: Right. And so Method man is standing next to him as he tells this story. Right. You know, or as he tries to like make this reasoning the next scene, like not even scene, like, so they cut over to like 20 seconds later and they are wrapping the body up in whatever stuff they're going to carry it out in. And the dad goes and Puts the challah inside the. You know, the thing that they're wrapping them up in. And Kyra Sedgwick looks at Method man and goes, don't ask. He was there. It was 20 seconds ago. He just saw the whole. What? Don't ask what? Like, that's the kind of thing that keeps on happening in this movie that I'm like, I feel inconsiderate. Yeah. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills here. Like, even, like, Death of the. The boyfriend is like, the. The younger brother gives him laxatives, and then he finds out that the boyfriend has colitis, and he's like, oh, no. Oh, no. But I'm like, I don't know what colitis is and how that would affect someone. So, like, they don't explain it. They just show, like, it zooming in on him and him looking like, oh, no, not colitis. And I'm like, what does that mean? What would that do to him? I don't know what that would do you. [01:51:11] Speaker B: You've completely pushed me away and then brought me back to this film. I. I would never have watched it until. [01:51:22] Speaker A: It'S, like, so confused by what that was supposed to be like a. [01:51:27] Speaker B: Tim Robinson fucking skit. [01:51:30] Speaker A: Right. So I do not recommend Bad Shabbos either. It is not mixed. Nuts. If you were thinking about going and watching a madcap, you know, thriller, it's not. It's not mixed. [01:51:43] Speaker B: Well, at least the filmmaker was sorry that you hated it. [01:51:50] Speaker A: Did the thing that I absolutely hate, which is when I write a negative review, negative review on letterboxd. And then the, like, director responds, I hate that. And it's always like. It's really passive aggressive. Like, because they're. They don't feel. Fight you on it or anything. Like, oh, I'm so sorry you didn't like this one. Well, maybe you'd like our other one. Blah, blah, blah. Like, there was one that I wrote that I was like, this one does, like, several racist things in it. And the director was like, oh, nuts. You didn't like it. Well, I'm so sorry. Maybe the other one you won't like. I just said your movie's racist. Are you not gonna deal with it? [01:52:27] Speaker B: Another one of my movies? [01:52:28] Speaker A: Maybe you. Maybe this one would hit you better. So, yeah, the, like, one of the filmmakers commented on my hatred of this on letterbox with a cutesy little, like, aw, shucks. Well, maybe you'd like our other one. It's on tubi. No. [01:52:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:52:42] Speaker A: Absolutely not. I will not. [01:52:44] Speaker B: I will tear through a couple Here. So obviously everyone loves District 9, don't they? What's not to love? Five stars. Five fucking stars. Greatest fucking sci fi of the 2000s of the 2000s, right? [01:52:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:53:00] Speaker B: I say 2000s because it's nearly 20 years old. It was 2007. How is that film nearly 20 years old? How? Tell me how that has happened. I'm gonna be 47 in a few months. [01:53:10] Speaker A: It's true. Yeah. [01:53:11] Speaker B: Can you believe that? [01:53:12] Speaker A: Pretty close to it. [01:53:14] Speaker B: So do you know why I watched District 9? Why? The only reason. The one only reason that I watched it. [01:53:20] Speaker A: I don't. [01:53:21] Speaker B: Because the boys came home from school last week and Peter said, oh, we had a substitute teacher today. He was South African. You said the magic words. [01:53:29] Speaker A: You know what else is South African? [01:53:31] Speaker B: Pretty much immediately after dinner, I went and watched Vicus do his thing. Hasn't aged a day. Is still relevant, is still exciting. God, what a film. Builds to a crescendo. Loads of different genres in there. It is challenging. It is smelly and sweaty and if anything, 20 years later, it. It's endearingly cheap. Some of the CG and some of the effects just looks lovely. Lovely in a way. I. My heart goes a flutter whenever. When we see Ed 209 for the first time in the OCP boardroom and he's stopped motion, right? So the CG in District 9 in 2025 gives me that same flutter like. Oh, that's so good. I love it. The drop off between District 9 and Gran Turismo is, I think, to be studied. What? You know, fuck. Neil, man, what happened? Just for a while there, with every passing movie, it was diminishing returns. Then you killed a few big projects. He killed robocop, he killed Alien. And it never quite came back for him, did it? [01:54:41] Speaker A: Yeah, it's so, so weird. [01:54:42] Speaker B: Very strange trajectory on that career. Very weird. But we'll always have District 9. [01:54:48] Speaker A: Yeah. Came out with a banger. And listen, most of us never have that, so you gotta give him that. [01:54:52] Speaker B: Yes, Neil, you achieved more in one movie than I'll achieve in my entire lifetime. But Chappie was one of the worst films I've ever seen in my life, so you can't take that away from you either. [01:55:06] Speaker A: Yeah, I did not watch that one. And aside from that, dog is eating an instant camera. What a menace. [01:55:12] Speaker B: That could be. Toxic for him, probably. [01:55:15] Speaker A: Also, it ruined my pictures for my birthday. [01:55:17] Speaker B: Yeah, it was. Do that too. [01:55:18] Speaker A: Get printed. [01:55:19] Speaker B: Get it printed and we'll end on a kind of a troubling one. Right. [01:55:24] Speaker A: Oh, okay. [01:55:25] Speaker B: So I saw a French psychodrama. A French kind of horror. Psycho thriller. Psychological. [01:55:34] Speaker A: One that might sound familiar to some of our. [01:55:36] Speaker B: Well, I loved it. Right. I loved. Deals with themes of. Let's think. Kind of going to the Stan for murderers, serial killer Stan culture, true crime obsession. True crime obsession. Yes. Desensitization in the face of online gore and snuff videos. You know, D. Just disconnection from the modern world in the face of the digital self. Right. And I love this movie. I really, really enjoyed it. And it was. It's called Red Rooms and it. It isn't one I'd seen before, or at least I thought. [01:56:18] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:56:19] Speaker B: Until I went to rate it on letterboxd and found that I'd watched it just under a year ago. [01:56:25] Speaker A: Yeah. Together with. [01:56:27] Speaker B: With my co host, Corrigan. And I remember loving it at the time. I was very. I was delighted to find that I'd rated it the same both times. That was good. [01:56:35] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:56:35] Speaker B: But listener, listener, please don't underestimate just how jarring it is to watch a movie. And there wasn't. There wasn't even the littlest flicker of recognition. [01:56:48] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. That was what you said afterwards. You're like. Like nothing. There was no point in it where you were like, wait, have I seen this? [01:56:54] Speaker B: Familiar. Nothing rang. There were no echoes. Not even echoes in my mind of having maybe ever seen this movie before. This was an entirely new movie. And then I jumped onto my letterbox and it said, euric did this before. In October 2024. I was like, I. For a half a second, it was like there was a fucking. Another me doing other me shit. [01:57:14] Speaker A: Right. [01:57:14] Speaker B: You know, like me clean shaving, me watching movies and rigged him. So Corry and I talk this through and we think what could be at play here? And traced the steps back. [01:57:29] Speaker A: Yep. [01:57:29] Speaker B: And in October last year, it would. Would have been just after I'd come home from New York City. [01:57:35] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:57:35] Speaker B: I still had a little stash of downers I was working through. I was still enjoying my Xanax and my Valium, my Zop. A clone. And that's what I'm putting that down. [01:57:47] Speaker A: Your zed drugs. [01:57:48] Speaker B: My zed compounds, yes. [01:57:52] Speaker A: Yeah, that's. We're gonna. You know, sometimes this feels like the memory thing is like, troubling, but then with that context, like. Okay, no, those are. Those things are known for kind of erasing. What? [01:58:03] Speaker B: Yeah. And that's exactly what it was. Look, it's. If anything, it's a treat because I know there are other movies back there Which I'd have the same reaction to if I were to watch basically anything from that six month period. I think if you were to throw one in front of me now, I'd be like, pass me the popcorn. We're about to watch a new movie. [01:58:20] Speaker A: Aside from humane, which you can't watch again because you already. [01:58:23] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:58:24] Speaker A: Had the best time you possibly could. [01:58:26] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:58:29] Speaker A: Well, friends, thank you for joining us once again. [01:58:31] Speaker B: That was the ketamine one, wasn't it? [01:58:33] Speaker A: Yeah, that was. [01:58:35] Speaker B: No, I'm not watching, by the way. [01:58:36] Speaker A: Because you say it like that. When I mentioned that you had told this story on the podcast to someone else and I said ketamine, because that's what you said. And they were like, ketamine. I was like, ketamine. I mean, ketamine. But now I talk like you, so. [01:58:55] Speaker B: Yeah, you do. [01:58:56] Speaker A: And I talk like you. I'm just trying to figure out what the dog is eating. He is. He's reached that point, dear friends, where he's like, it's time for you to tell them to stay spooky and pay attention to me. [01:59:10] Speaker B: Okay, well, I guess who are we to go against the whims and wants of Walter. [01:59:17] Speaker A: Walter Groggins. [01:59:18] Speaker B: Yep, Walter Groggins. [01:59:21] Speaker A: But you've got a few assignments from this week for things. [01:59:24] Speaker B: Yeah, we want to see. It's not just this. It's this. I'd love any and all instances of that you see in the wild, please. Any bits of joag, live, actual in the flesh happenings that we speak about on this part of the prodcast. Prodcast. We're saving the broadcast for next year in London. Turn up. Get a prod. [01:59:46] Speaker A: When I get. When I. What am I gonna do? I'm gonna power bomb you in front of. [01:59:50] Speaker B: Yeah, we might practice some AEW moves. [01:59:53] Speaker A: Yes. [01:59:53] Speaker B: Corey wants to powerbomb me through the Joagon ounce table. So maybe we'll do that. [01:59:57] Speaker A: Maybe onto some tacks, if possible. [01:59:59] Speaker B: Yeah, maybe. Maybe so. [02:00:01] Speaker A: We'll see about that. [02:00:01] Speaker B: And thank you every, each and single, every one of you for. Let's just stop. Stay spooky. Thank you. We're done. [02:00:09] Speaker A: It.